Mr Renlund - throw away supernatural inanimate objects

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_I have a question
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Mr Renlund - throw away supernatural inanimate objects

Post by _I have a question »

With a complete lack of self-awareness, Mr Renlund tells the story of Congolese people joining the Church...
Before their conversion, they worshipped inanimate objects, believing that the items possessed supernatural powers.3 After conversion, many made a pilgrimage to one of the countless waterfalls along the Congo River, such as the Nzongo Falls.4 These converts threw their previously idolized objects into the waterfalls as a symbol to God and others that they had discarded their old traditions and accepted Jesus Christ. They intentionally did not throw their objects into calm, shallow waters; they threw them into the churning waters of a massive waterfall, where the items became unrecoverable. These actions were a token of a new but unwavering commitment to Jesus Christ.

https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/stu ... d?lang=eng

Given that the Book of Mormon was supposedly produced by an inanimate object that Joseph Smith suggested possessed supernatural powers - in treasure seeking and in "translation", I think Mr Renlund should be explaining that the Congolese threw away Congolese inanimate objects possessing supernatural powers, in favour of an American one...
“When we are confronted with evidence that challenges our deeply held beliefs we are more likely to reframe the evidence than we are to alter our beliefs. We simply invent new reasons, new justifications, new explanations. Sometimes we ignore the evidence altogether.” (Mathew Syed 'Black Box Thinking')
_Finn the human
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Re: Mr Renlund - throw away supernatural inanimate objects

Post by _Finn the human »

The efficacy of Dumbos black feather or a crucifix for warding off vampires readily comes to mind as counter examples to Elder Renlunds dismissiveness of inanimate objects in a faith setting. More to the point, the object really doesn’t matter at all. It’s faith that’s the active ingredient, or at least a very potent placebo.
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_reflexzero
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Re: Mr Renlund - throw away supernatural inanimate objects

Post by _reflexzero »

Makes me wonder how many members it would take to push a temple off a cliff.
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_Stem
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Re: Mr Renlund - throw away supernatural inanimate objects

Post by _Stem »

Pretty sure that's what the Book of Mormon peoples did too. That's why we can find evidence of them.
_Holy Ghost
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Re: Mr Renlund - throw away supernatural inanimate objects

Post by _Holy Ghost »

So are Mormons throwing away their temple garments now?
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_I have a question
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Re: Mr Renlund - throw away supernatural inanimate objects

Post by _I have a question »

reflexzero wrote:Makes me wonder how many members it would take to push a temple off a cliff.

Great point, temples are indeed believed to be supernatural inanimate objects.
“When we are confronted with evidence that challenges our deeply held beliefs we are more likely to reframe the evidence than we are to alter our beliefs. We simply invent new reasons, new justifications, new explanations. Sometimes we ignore the evidence altogether.” (Mathew Syed 'Black Box Thinking')
_huckelberry
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Re: Mr Renlund - throw away supernatural inanimate objects

Post by _huckelberry »

When I read the piece of article I noticed that the objects were thrown away not because they were connected to the supernatural but they were connected to a different claim to loyalty. The people changed their loyalty to Jesus so tossed the old authority symbols or connection.That is not very unusual.
_I have a question
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Re: Mr Renlund - throw away supernatural inanimate objects

Post by _I have a question »

huckelberry wrote:When I read the piece of article I noticed that the objects were thrown away not because they were connected to the supernatural but they were connected to a different claim to loyalty. The people changed their loyalty to Jesus so tossed the old authority symbols or connection.That is not very unusual.
I agree. The point of the OP was about how Mr Renlund framed the inanimate object worship as "bad" and needing to be thrown away.
Before their conversion, they worshipped inanimate objects, believing that the items possessed supernatural powers...
He failed to acknowledge that following their conversion they would still be expected to worship inanimate objects, and hold a belief that the new items possess supernatural powers.
“When we are confronted with evidence that challenges our deeply held beliefs we are more likely to reframe the evidence than we are to alter our beliefs. We simply invent new reasons, new justifications, new explanations. Sometimes we ignore the evidence altogether.” (Mathew Syed 'Black Box Thinking')
_Gadianton
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Re: Mr Renlund - throw away supernatural inanimate objects

Post by _Gadianton »

Isn’t throwing a talisman into a waterfall itself a ritual, and an unauthorized one? Not to mention superstitious. It’s like stories of chopping up an ouija board to make sure it doesn’t reappear under the bed.

Make no mistake, Renlund himself is happy about superstition. As soon as people quit being superstitious, they slack on tithing and skip meetings, and pretty soon just leave.
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Re: Mr Renlund - throw away supernatural inanimate objects

Post by _moksha »

"In the end, there can only be one seer stone."
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