Complex?

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Dr. Shades
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Re: Complex?

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I Have Questions wrote:
Tue Jul 08, 2025 8:44 am
This Wikipedia page specifically about the book containing a comprehensive summary of its contents and main themes. It also contains links to other resources about the book and its contents.
Ahh yes, good point.
I ask again, is a link to a product advertisement now to be considered a valid link?
Not by itself, no.
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Re: Complex?

Post by I Have Questions »

Dr. Shades wrote:
Tue Jul 08, 2025 8:54 am
I Have Questions wrote:
Tue Jul 08, 2025 8:44 am
This Wikipedia page specifically about the book containing a comprehensive summary of its contents and main themes. It also contains links to other resources about the book and its contents.
Ahh yes, good point.
I ask again, is a link to a product advertisement now to be considered a valid link?
Not by itself, no.
If I tell you what the product is, and a very brief description of the product, does it become valid?
Premise 1. Eyewitness testimony is notoriously unreliable.
Premise 2. The best evidence for the Book of Mormon is eyewitness testimony.
Conclusion. Therefore, the best evidence for the Book of Mormon is notoriously unreliable.
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Dr. Shades
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Re: Complex?

Post by Dr. Shades »

I Have Questions wrote:
Tue Jul 08, 2025 8:56 am
If I tell you what the product is, and a very brief description of the product, does it become valid?
I'd have to evaluate it on a case-by-case basis.
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Re: Complex?

Post by I Have Questions »

Dr. Shades wrote:
Tue Jul 08, 2025 9:30 am
I Have Questions wrote:
Tue Jul 08, 2025 8:56 am
If I tell you what the product is, and a very brief description of the product, does it become valid?
I'd have to evaluate it on a case-by-case basis.
Yes, ambiguity will solve the problem.
Premise 1. Eyewitness testimony is notoriously unreliable.
Premise 2. The best evidence for the Book of Mormon is eyewitness testimony.
Conclusion. Therefore, the best evidence for the Book of Mormon is notoriously unreliable.
I Have Questions
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Re: Complex?

Post by I Have Questions »

huckelberry wrote:
Thu Jun 12, 2025 4:14 pm
It is sometimes claimed that complexity of the Book of Mormon shows Joseph did not invent it. My familiarity with the book has faded over the years so I am hoping some with lots of familiarity like Shulem could reflect on whether there is much complexity.

My faded impression is there is not much theological development, there are cycles of loss and gain of faith. With these cycles there are also lots of wars for vague reasons.

Perhaps one can say the book is complex because a lot of actions are described. Am I wrong to think this is mostly add on repetition of a few themes? Complexity might be how subsequent events depend upon perhaps multiple past threads of events.

Are there patterns of events an author such as Joseph might be would have trouble tracking without getting confused?
Let’s get back to the topic in question.

One element against the notion that the Book of Mormon is complex in a consistent manner, is the narrative about the indigenous population in the land that Nephi supposedly traveled to - The Americas. The book claims it was an uninhabited land. Yet within the book it relates the story of the Jaredites and the Mulekites who both supposedly travelled, at separate times, settled there prior to Nephi’s group. So which is it, a land that was kept uninhabited, or a land that was already settled by the Jaredites and then the Mulekites?

Is that complexity, or is that Joseph not keeping his story straight?
Premise 1. Eyewitness testimony is notoriously unreliable.
Premise 2. The best evidence for the Book of Mormon is eyewitness testimony.
Conclusion. Therefore, the best evidence for the Book of Mormon is notoriously unreliable.
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Re: Complex?

Post by malkie »

I Have Questions wrote:
Tue Jul 08, 2025 10:11 am
huckelberry wrote:
Thu Jun 12, 2025 4:14 pm
It is sometimes claimed that complexity of the Book of Mormon shows Joseph did not invent it. My familiarity with the book has faded over the years so I am hoping some with lots of familiarity like Shulem could reflect on whether there is much complexity.

My faded impression is there is not much theological development, there are cycles of loss and gain of faith. With these cycles there are also lots of wars for vague reasons.

Perhaps one can say the book is complex because a lot of actions are described. Am I wrong to think this is mostly add on repetition of a few themes? Complexity might be how subsequent events depend upon perhaps multiple past threads of events.

Are there patterns of events an author such as Joseph might be would have trouble tracking without getting confused?
Let’s get back to the topic in question.

One element against the notion that the Book of Mormon is complex in a consistent manner, is the narrative about the indigenous population in the land that Nephi supposedly traveled to - The Americas. The book claims it was an uninhabited land. Yet within the book it relates the story of the Jaredites and the Mulekites who both supposedly travelled, at separate times, settled there prior to Nephi’s group. So which is it, a land that was kept uninhabited, or a land that was already settled by the Jaredites and then the Mulekites?

Is that complexity, or is that Joseph not keeping his story straight?
I really do not want to read the relevant chapters of the Book of Mormon, but I seem to remember that there may be a faithful explanation: the land was to be reserved for the righteous, so perhaps not solely for Lehi's family.
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