Peterson’s comment to which Rollo refers appears in the context of a discussion specifically regarding anti-Semitism.
Therefore, Rollo’s comment, “Well, using DCP's logic, I guess the Jews can't count BY as ‘among their few friends in the world’” places Brigham Young in that group of anti-Semites to which Peterson alludes.
As the information provided in my post illustrates, to suggest that Brigham in anyway reflects the anti-Semitic group to which Peterson referred is a serious misrepresentation of the facts.
Peterson’s comment to which Rollo refers appears in the context of a discussion specifically regarding anti-Semitism.
Therefore, Rollo’s comment, “Well, using DCP's logic, I guess the Jews can't count BY as ‘among their few friends in the world’” places Brigham Young in that group of anti-Semites to which Peterson alludes.
As the information provided in my post illustrates, to suggest that Brigham in anyway reflects the anti-Semitic group to which Peterson referred is a serious misrepresentation of the facts.
Your the first person to say the word anti-semite. Rollo did not say anti-semite.
Learn how to debate before opening your browser next time girlie.
And crawling on the planet's face Some insects called the human race Lost in time And lost in space...and meaning
Learn how to debate before opening your browser next time girlie.
When the best that you can contribute to the issue is calling someone the name "girlie" it is quite clear that you are, indeed, the master of such things. Thanks for the helpful tip on the art of debate.
I see your speaking as a man and raise you $10 dollars.
How about simply the misuse of a late 19th century religious quote spoken by a man of whom I myself have heard the Jewish Rabbi of the Salt Lake City congregation Kol Ami praise as an individual whose feelings of brotherly kindness towards Jews allowed in 1873 for the formation of the first formal Jewish congregation in Utah, even when Jews struggled with anti-Semitic agendas witnessed throughout most of the United States.
The quote in question of course simply reflects Brigham Young’s 19th century opinion that based upon the scriptural grounds that "the first shall be last, and the last shall be first,” the conversion of the Jewish nation would not occur before Christ's second coming. I can assure you that as a 19th century Christian, Brigham was not alone in this opinion.
To paint Brigham Young as an anti-Semite, however, based upon his interpretation of this New Testament passage is a gross act of intentional slander.
When it comes to Brigham Young’s interactions with the Jewish community, one should note that whereas Jews often suffered from anti-Semitic actions throughout most of the United States, the Hebrew Benevolent Society was formed in Utah in 1864.
The group held religious services in the LDS Masonic Hall in the spring of 1866. The year 1866 also marks the date for the first Salt Lake cemetery deeded to the Jewish community by Brigham Young.
Also, in 1867, Jews observed High Holyday (Rosh Hashonah [New Year] and Yom Kippur) in the Seventies Hall at the special invitation of President Young.
Clearly, for an anti-Semite, Brigham Young chose a peculiar way to manifest his disdain.
You seem to have glossed over the passage. Not only does BY argue that in order for Jews to become Christians they will, in effect, have to efface major portions of their identities, he also conflates them with Native Americans. And as we both know, BY's views towards the Indians wasn't exactly...."kosher."
Way back when the Holocaust was happening...Hilter Hated gypsy's and gay people, hence the triangles they have at the holocaut museum besides just the yellow ones for Jewish people....
Deaf or handicapped people never even made it to the concentration camps, they were killed before the others, They never even got a chance to get on the trains and go to the concentration camps to be gassed by Hilter....
There are no triangles for handicapped people...which breaks my heart because I have a deaf son and would love to honor him by wearing a "Triangle"
I do wear a "black" triangle for the Gypsy in me...and I wear a "pink" triangle to honor my gay son.
To be baptized by the Mormons I can understand why Jewish people are so offended
They are in fact doing exactly what Hitler did only they are still alive...at least their descendents are. to be killed again by
Hitler/Mormons
That is why I would prefer to be a gay gypsy because the Mormons would not baptize me after I am dead, because there would have been no record of my exsistence on this earth...
from Girlie here
Vegas's posts take him ten minutes to write
I was just chastised by him......
When I wake up I will be hungry....but this feels so good right now aaahhhhhh........
Perhaps in the sense of summary, not in the sense of failing to devote a bit of thought to the issue of Brigham Young and Judaism.
Not only does BY argue that in order for Jews to become Christians they will, in effect, have to efface major portions of their identities,
But from a Latter-day Saint perspective isn’t that true for all people who leave behind a false set of religious precepts? It’s not just the Jews, Mormons are equally concerned that apostate Christians “efface major portions of their identifies.”
he also conflates them with Native Americans.
True enough.
And as we both know, BY's views towards the Indians wasn't exactly...."kosher."
Well said. I won’t pretend that Brigham Young’s beliefs were kosher.
No one ought to take the impression, however, that “the Jews can't count BY as ‘among their few friends in the world’” i.e. the anti-Semites.
Perhaps in the sense of summary, not in the sense of failing to devote a bit of thought to the issue of Brigham Young and Judaism.
Not only does BY argue that in order for Jews to become Christians they will, in effect, have to efface major portions of their identities,
But from a Latter-day Saint perspective isn’t that true for all people who leave behind a false set of religious precepts? It’s not just the Jews, Mormons are equally concerned that apostate Christians “efface major portions of their identifies.”
Eh. I suppose from a more hardcore, TBM, ultra-orthodox POV this is true, though I prefer a more pluralistic and tolerant view. I also think the ethnic component of Jewishness is rather different from that of a strictly "apostate Christian."
he also conflates them with Native Americans.
True enough.
And as we both know, BY's views towards the Indians wasn't exactly...."kosher."
Well said. I won’t pretend that Brigham Young’s beliefs were kosher.
No one ought to take the impression, however, that “the Jews can't count BY as ‘among their few friends in the world’” i.e. the anti-Semites.
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I don't think Jew-Gentile relations are a simple, black-and-white affair, with everyone coming down on the side of either Jews or anti-Semites. Granted, BY was not anti-Semetic to the degree of, say, Hitler, but he wasn't exactly "philosemetic" either.
Regardless, welcome to the board, E.! I have very much enjoyed your first few posts. By any chance do you go by another name elsewhere?
Way back when the Holocaust was happening...Hilter Hated gypsy's and gay people, hence the triangles they have at the holocaust museum besides just the yellow ones for Jewish people....
Indeed, the Latter-day Saint practice to provide those of a Jewish ancestry with a chance for a vicarious ordinance which from an LDS perspective will—if accepted—provide those individuals with an opportunity to receive God’s greatest reward is in every way comparable to the activities sponsored by Adolf Hitler in an effort to gas innocent men, women and children.
Given the absolute appropriateness of your analogy, we really should round up every one of those modern-day necro-baptizing Nazi’s who are seeking to destroy the Jewish nation and, well, put them in the very concentration camps that their co-conspirators built throughout Germany and Poland.
Regardless, welcome to the board, E.! I have very much enjoyed your first few posts.
Thanks for the warm welcome. Though I often disagree, I always enjoy reading what you have to say.
By any chance do you go by another name elsewhere?
Yes, but I’m only a minor player on such boards. For instance, I’m not distinguished enough to occupy a position of interest in Mister Scratch’s Insider’s Guide to the Fairboard.
Regardless, welcome to the board, E.! I have very much enjoyed your first few posts.
Thanks for the warm welcome. Though I often disagree, I always enjoy reading what you have to say.
By any chance do you go by another name elsewhere?
Yes, but I’m only a minor player on such boards. For instance, I’m not distinguished enough to occupy a position of interest in Mister Scratch’s Insider’s Guide to the Fairboard.
Regards,
E.E.
Ah, of course. Well, in any case, please don't feel left out! Unfortunately for the both of us, the FAIRboard is kaput. However, as you may have noticed, our faithful correspondent, The Webelo, appears to have sighted a "phoenix, rising out of Arizona," so you may see renewed activity on the blog very soon.... ; )