Peterson and Gee's libel against Ritner?

[_beastie]

Kevin,

I can understand why Mauss became uncomfortable when he realized this involved juliann. She was his student, they were friendly, he is apparently a kind, gentle man, the sort who would be uncomfortable being put in a situation where he had inadvertently criticized a student/friend.

Juliann isn't a glutton for punishment. I honestly think that either language processing problems or, more likely, the processing problems resultant from being a True Believer, create an inability to process information in a reliable, stable fashion. She really doesn't think you are embarrassing her. She believes she "wins" these "contests". It amazes me that she can participate in conversations where her position has been exposed as flawed (see, for example, this thread: http://www.mormonapologetics.org/index. ... opic=21404 ) and still, at the end, maintain clear victory. It is mind boggling to me. But I have concluded it is genuine. If it were an act to cover embarrassment, she would begin to withdraw from these confrontations, but she doesn't. She goes into full battle mode, fully confident of her imminent victory. In fact, she will likely use this post from me to somehow create a new victory on her part.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=cXQdXB40UIY

[_Jersey Girl]

Pass the mega-pep-o-mint breath mints east. Soon Vicki will be apologizing to Kev, like she did to Kerry (I wear my garments under my) Shirts...

Boy, you have no idea, Polyg. Jersey Girl, a.k.a. "Vicki,", a.k.a. "Lady Sundancer", claims to be some kind of freewheeling, easy-go-lucky type of fun chick, but the fact of the matter is that she likes to lecture people and tell them how to behave. Behold this PM she sent to me:

1. You are under the mistaken impression that I'm on a "side". I am my own side.

2. Itchy was a direct reaction to your blog. So be it.

3. Where the hell were you when the Z trolls were badgering harmony and Shades? Were you sitting on your ass watching Shades and I confront them? Please don't feign that you give a s*** about either Shades or harmony or the information that was being posted about them.

4. I have no problem whatsoever dealing with Pahoran. I've gone nose to nose with him more than once, had no trouble holding my own with him. He infact left Z after a series of exchanges with me. He's a non-issue to me.

5. What you're doing with Coggins is uncategorically wrong. You and others (coffee, Mercury) taunt the living f*** out of him on a regular basis. When he responds in kind you (the collective you) mock his religion. When he chooses to disengage, you (the collective you) make him out to be a coward. When he chooses to use humor as a form of response, you (the collective you) accuse him of not being well educated or highlighting his alcoholism. What's next? You gonna cut on him for taking care of his ill wife?

6. Coggins admitted publicly that he's an alcoholic and you (the collective you) persist in making bitchy little remarks about it as a form of response. coffee, on the otherhand is applauded for his deficiencies because they are combat related. Give me a f****** break!

7. You recently made a remark about Coggins' age as it relates to his ability to learn. Who in the holy living hell do you think you are, Scratch? If you're so well educated then grind him down with topical points.

8. I have little if any respect for one who refuses to divulge information publicly while at the same time using the disclosures of others to disparage them.

9. Do not make remarks to me about immoral people. In my mind, using someones disease, disability or condition as a form of ad hominem is likewise immoral.

10. I will defend whatever and whomever I please. I'm not in your "club" or on your "side". I am an independent here and I'll criticize whatever I oppose.

Anything else?

Yup. She shore is on her own side!

Thank you for posting my private message response to your inquiry!

You are the move you make, Scratch. How many hours do you spend collecting the words of others to make this board into your own personal vendetta gossip rag? You are a talented writer and yet you use your skills to engage in tabloid journalism on this board.

You and Kevin are cut from the same cloth. You are each out to exact revenge on people whom you feel wronged you going back years and you expect others to be entertained by it.

What is your word worth to us, Scratch? You make public claims that you will not attack DCP or Coggins and yet shortly thereafter you find some reason to do just that. You ask me privately to explain to you why I would support Loran and when I answer you....you keep the message to later disclose it publicly because you think that now you need to "get even" with me! I ask you, how sick and miserable is that?

You're a spineless little coward, a common gossip who posts private messages (like Kevin posts email correspondence) and whose so called word is worth absolutely nothing.

You bet I'm my own side and thank you for posting my private words to you to prove it! Well done!

Jersey Girl

[_beastie]

juliann:

Notice that in Kevin's world, if he emails someone, someone else has "dragged him into it". In Kevin's mind he has nothing to do with it. As you can see, he is becoming defensive about his exchange and trying to explain it away even though he is now admitting his target was obviously not happy with what he did to him. I had a pleasant exchange with both of the scholars Kevin emailed with false information and both verified that I had accurately represented their work once they were given an opportunity to see what I actually said. Now Kevin obviously has their email addresses and he can certainly email them again to verify what they think about what he did to them. (in fact, Kevin...I think it would be very helpful to both of these men to see what you are now doing to Ritner).

I, for one, would love to see these email exchanges. I would like to see how Juliann's writings were compatible with Bromley's theory while completely ignoring the fact that the new religion has to be viewed as subversive by the larger society in order for oppositional groups, as used in the model, to be formed.

[_Jersey Girl]

Jersey Girl

3. Why do you claim that you haven't the ability to respond on MAD when you obviously sockpuppeted your way into it?

Scratch

Uh, have you not used multiple aliases yourself, such as Lady Sundancer? Oh, wait, that's right: you're not actually criticizing anyone, nor does your criticism have any weight or real meaning, since this is all fun and games for you. You're not on anyone's side. It's just about Jersey Girl.

Wrong. When I recently went back to MAD to settle a matter, I identified myself going in. There's no reason whatsoever that Kevin can't do the same. None.

[_Jersey Girl]

Jersey Girl

2. Isn't the truth that you are one who habitually produces confidential email online?

Scratch

Isn't the truth that you are the one who continually tries to assert moral authority on the basis of little more than a correspondence course education and a "tough Jersey chick" attitude? Who in the hell do *YOU* think you are?

I think I'm someone who isn't going to feed you information about myself privately or publicly. That's who I am, Scratch.

[_Jersey Girl]

Pass the mega-pep-o-mint breath mints east. Soon Vicki will be apologizing to Kev, like she did to Kerry (I wear my garments under my) Shirts...

And who do you apologize to, Porter? Or do you just bleed out on people?

[_Jersey Girl]

Excuse me, something seems to have escaped my attention.

Scratch

Isn't the truth that you are the one who continually tries to assert moral authority on the basis of little more than a correspondence course education and a "tough Jersey chick" attitude? Who in the hell do *YOU* think you are

What "correspondence course education" are you referring to, Scratch? Are you thinking of the online class I mentioned when I posted in support of Loran's expressed desire to continue his education? An online class is perfect for him considering that due to family circumstances he might need to stick around home base.

Is that how low you go, Scratch? You dog Loran about furthering is education and when he expresses a desire to do just that, you dog him some more? And not only that, you spite anyone who encourages him by distorting the simple mention of an online course into "little more than a correspondence course education?"

What else do you distort, Scratch? The relationship between morality and education?

Your own conduct proves otherwise.

Jersey Girl

[_dartagnan]

Juliann is such a coward. She is still talking smack over there because she knows she will be given free reign to say whatever she wants without any critical responses. She refuses to come here because she knows she cannot hold her own.

The only people who feel I dragged these people into something are the LDS apologists at MAD who don't like what they provided me. Juliann, for example, had been citing Mauss and Bromley for more than a year in her back-handed slapdowns of anti-Mormons. I got fed up with it and decided to find out if they supported her in her little agenda. None of them do. So how does she respond? By accusing me of dragging them into something sinister as if I were the one misusing them. Why doesn't she email them and ask them if they trust me or her? Wo do you think Ritner is upset with, me or Peterson? Juliann is making it sound like I take advantage of these people. She is desperate to create something sinister out of nothing.

Gee and Peterson have been regularly propagating the accusation that Ritner was "removed" from his dissertation committee. I decided to email Ritner finally, and find out the story. When it turns out Ritner's side contradicts Gee's, I am accused, again, of "dragging" Ritner into something. Yea, Ritner seems so upset with me.

Funny how Ritner, Bromley, Mauss, Mark Smith, and the number of other scholars I have emailed and retrived information from, have never expressed any resentment in our email exchanges. Juliann wants to create the picture as if everyone I email regrets it later. They don't. In fact what I see most often is a willingness to share information with me - obviously or else there would be no substance for them to cry over -because they are actually upset with the way people like Juliann and other LDS apologists have misused their work.

[_dartagnan]

Jersey, do us all a favor and take your personality disorder elsewhere. I don't care what you have to say ( I haven't for quite a while) and it appears nobody else does either. Please don't turn this thread into another Jerseygirl show.

[_Jersey Girl]

Kevin

Gee and Peterson have been regularly propagating the accusation that Ritner was "removed" from his dissertation committee. I decided to email Ritner finally, and find out the story. When it turns out Ritner's side contradicts Gee's, I am accused, again, of "dragging" Ritner into something. Yea, Ritner seems so upset with me.

It seems to me that the comments on the part of Gee/Peterson and Ritner have the potential to be professionally damaging on some level to all parties involved. Aren't you yourself engaging in the propagation (that looks like a spelling error!) of something for which there is no conclusion?

If the comments you posted by Ritner are whole and sound, then your part is done, Kevin. You've alerted Ritner and what follows is his call. You may never know if he made the call, how he made it or what the outcome is.

Having said that, I don't see a purpose in your reporting it other than to erect a doubt in the minds of people that can never be fully resolved on boards like these.

Why do that?

Is it a combination of you're wanting to see the Gee/DCP "team" taken down a peg and Ritner publicly justified?

You will never know the outcome, Kevin. You're not in the loop any more than anyone else reading and responding to these threads. Your goal if I have characterized it correctly, can never be met.

Do you not see that?

Jersey Girl