Pasted below is Spong's reply to a question re the 2nd coming. I think it probably is representitive of most thinking here???:
C. S. of NC, writes:
Protestant churches in the U.S. seem to believe in a "second coming of Christ." What do you believe?
Dear C,
I find belief in the second coming of Christ to be generally limited to Southern fundamentalist and evangelical churches. I do not see references to or hear people speak much about the second coming outside the South.
That phrase was popular in early Christianity when they came to identify Jesus with the Son of Man whose purpose in Jewish mythology was to inaugurate the Kingdom of God. Much of the New Testament is written from this perspective. The healing miracles attributed to Jesus were in fact designed to be understood originally as signs that he was ushering in the Kingdom of God. Paul even called Jesus "the first fruits of the Kingdom of God."
However, that expected Kingdom of God did not come in the life of Jesus and history moved on. Christians then began to refer to Jesus' life as a "foretaste" of that kingdom. So the idea was born that the Kingdom that Jesus revealed would only be fully inaugurated when he came again. This second coming was then projected to accompany the end of the world.
I, for one, have little interest in this concept. If I knew that the Kingdom of God would come tomorrow, I do not believe I would do anything different. No one knows what any tomorrow will bring. So my concentration is always on the present. I see little value in thinking about the Second Coming of Jesus or any other eschatological event.
The world will surely end some day. Perhaps the sun will burn out and life will become extinct. Perhaps one day we will experience "the big crunch" as the world once experienced "the big bang" and we will fall back into the sun and be extinguished by heat. Perhaps we Homo sapiens will so foul our environment that life will no longer be possible. I see all second coming language as symbolic of the incomplete nature of life and the constant hope and dream of fulfillment.
Second Coming language also always assumes a three tiered universe so that Jesus can come out of the sky in the same manner that he ascended into it. That is a nonsensical idea to me. So is the recent suggestion that Jesus would come from outer space. So I concentrate on what I know and what I have some chance of controlling.
On an even deeper level I think Christ comes each day in me when I live fully, love wastefully and dare to be all that I can be. When I assist others in the task of living loving and being, I think Christ comes to them. I commend that pattern to you. John Shelby Spong
This is how i see it. What about You? Warm regards, Roger
Or does he just throw a pile of topics face down on the floor, throw a dart in the air, and then spout off an I'm OK, your Ok schpal of nonsence.
Every word of this drivel is fueled by a man, who despite having spent the better part of 60 years as a student of religion, has no faith in God whatsoever. To have a testimony of Christ is to believe that he died and raised himself up from the dead, making possible the resurrection of us all.
Spong is delusional.
Lets take for example his view of God:
Spong’s View Of God
Spong rejects the Christian view of God as the Creator of the universe, which is distinct from Him and utterly dependent on Him for its existence. Instead, he plays a game of word magic:
We have come to the dawning realisation that God might not be separate from us but rather deep within us. (RBF p. 33)
Roger your study of this fools writings has seriously screwed with your head. This man is a heretic in the worst sence of the word. I highly advise you to throw away his trash and get back to studying the words of the Prophets and Apostles.
Last edited by Steeler [Crawler] on Fri Jun 22, 2007 2:38 am, edited 1 time in total.
We can easily forgive a child who is afraid of the dark; the real tragedy of life is when men are afraid of the light. - Plato
Ahhh the second coming has been coming for two thousand years now.... hmmm... ;-)
Personally, I think this idea is a dangerous one.
The more folks think there is no hope and look for someone outside of ourselves to save us all, the less chance we have of getting it together and fixing what is wrong with this world!
Whether or not a savior is coming, best act as if healing depends on us... do what we can rather than just accept the fact that evil will prevail and there is nothing we can do about it.
Ya know?
Just how I see it!
~dancer~
"The search for reality is the most dangerous of all undertakings for it destroys the world in which you live." Nisargadatta Maharaj
I find belief in the second coming of Christ to be generally limited to Southern fundamentalist and evangelical churches. I do not see references to or hear people speak much about the second coming outside the South
Is he saying that the Catholics, Lutherans, Northern Baptists...etc., don't believe in the Second Coming? 'Cause that sure looks like what he's saying. If so, he's sure wrong.
Jersey Girl
Failure is not falling down but refusing to get up.
Chinese Proverb
This coming from a member of the LDS cult who believes that the spirit of a dead indian gave Joseph Smith some records made of gold, who then translated them with a magic rock placed in a hat.
Jersey Girl wrote:Catholics, Lutherans, Northern Baptists...
How many Lutherans and catholics do you see calling their flock to repentance because "the end times" are here and they need to get right with this God guy. As for Northern Baptists, sure. Maybe the shifty eyed mouth breathers that congregate in strip mall chapels in northern towns believe in the second coming but then again they are simply a new vector of the social disease known as evangelical christianity creeping ever northward.
And speaking as a newly crowned southerner, they are as thick as cockroaches in an assistant crack whores bedroom down here.
And crawling on the planet's face Some insects called the human race Lost in time And lost in space...and meaning
Jersey Girl wrote:Catholics, Lutherans, Northern Baptists...
How many Lutherans and catholics do you see calling their flock to repentance because "the end times" are here and they need to get right with this God guy. As for Northern Baptists, sure. Maybe the shifty eyed mouth breathers that congregate in strip mall chapels in northern towns believe in the second coming but then again they are simply a new vector of the social disease known as evangelical christianity creeping ever northward.
And speaking as a newly crowned southerner, they are as thick as cockroaches in an assistant crack whores bedroom down here.
Please try reading the actual excerpt that I responded to, then bring your thoughts and the thimble that contains them back and we'll talk, okay?
Jersey Girl
Failure is not falling down but refusing to get up.
Chinese Proverb
Jersey Girl wrote:Catholics, Lutherans, Northern Baptists...
How many Lutherans and catholics do you see calling their flock to repentance because "the end times" are here and they need to get right with this God guy. As for Northern Baptists, sure. Maybe the shifty eyed mouth breathers that congregate in strip mall chapels in northern towns believe in the second coming but then again they are simply a new vector of the social disease known as evangelical christianity creeping ever northward.
And speaking as a newly crowned southerner, they are as thick as cockroaches in an assistant crack whores bedroom down here.
Please try reading the actual excerpt that I responded to, then bring your thoughts and the thimble that contains them back and we'll talk, okay?
Jersey Girl
Jersey, you were not supposed to respond. I don't really give a damn what you think.
The point I am making is that the evangelicals are a social disease. A Meme that has poisoned America and will, if left unchecked throw the north american continent into a dark age.
Because I'm bitter and cold and I enjoy belittling those who believe in faith as a valid method of running their life, I give you these chunks of fact. Not due to anything cruel but because I really enjoy being able to state these things. Just knowing that you will read them is good enough for me. The fact I fluster you so much that you can not come up with a coherent response is all the better.
And crawling on the planet's face Some insects called the human race Lost in time And lost in space...and meaning
Jersey Girl wrote:Catholics, Lutherans, Northern Baptists...
How many Lutherans and catholics do you see calling their flock to repentance because "the end times" are here and they need to get right with this God guy. As for Northern Baptists, sure. Maybe the shifty eyed mouth breathers that congregate in strip mall chapels in northern towns believe in the second coming but then again they are simply a new vector of the social disease known as evangelical christianity creeping ever northward.
And speaking as a newly crowned southerner, they are as thick as cockroaches in an assistant crack whores bedroom down here.
Please try reading the actual excerpt that I responded to, then bring your thoughts and the thimble that contains them back and we'll talk, okay?
Jersey Girl
Jersey, you were not supposed to respond. I don't really give a damn what you think.
The point I am making is that the evangelicals are a social disease. A Meme that has poisoned America and will, if left unchecked throw the north american continent into a dark age.
Because I'm bitter and cold and I enjoy belittling those who believe in faith as a valid method of running their life, I give you these chunks of fact. Not due to anything cruel but because I really enjoy being able to state these things. Just knowing that you will read them is good enough for me. The fact I fluster you so much that you can not come up with a coherent response is all the better.
Mercury,
Under what rule was I not to respond to your comments regarding an excerpt of my post? It's clear, Mercury, that you haven't got even the faintest idea of what is meant by a "Northern Baptist" or much of anything else that you commented on.
Flustered? Your ignorance amuses me. When you respond on point, I'll be glad to "come up with a coherent response". Until then, I await your posting evidence for the claims that you made regarding me.
Still waiting for hell to freeze over,
Jersey Girl
Failure is not falling down but refusing to get up.
Chinese Proverb
Try this. Northern Baptists are American Baptists. Southern Baptists are not American Baptists. I used the term "Northern Baptist" (which is an old term) to make a distinction between the American Baptists and Southern Baptists that Spong appears to be referring to in the hopes of not confusing the reader. Catholics, Lutherans, and Baptist denominations ALL call their congregations to repentance via Biblical scriptures and have the Second Coming as a core doctrine.
That is why I question Spong's statement.
The problem with folks who were raised up in Mormonism, so far as I can tell, is that they base their view of what constitutes "Baptist" on extreme fundamentalists and mainly Southern Baptists and haven't been taught or made aware that there exist all sorts of Baptists sects and alliances throughout the US and the world and that they aren't all interested in waving garments around or playing frisbee with the LDS Quad in Temple Square.
In my view, Spong's claim is inaccurate at best and intended to mislead.
Jersey Girl
Failure is not falling down but refusing to get up.
Chinese Proverb