Dart and Pumple debate from "Mad posters you want on MD

[_Pumplehoober]

Why do you think she loves it so much over there? That forum is her baby. She is God there. She gets to produce irrelevant rants about whomever she wants, and make the wildest of accusations with zero accountability. Best of all, her ego rarely suffers since the game is rigged to make sure she always appears right.

That sounds exactly like why you started your own message board, but then again you need people to show up too. Always a problem, that.

[_dartagnan]

That sounds exactly like why you started your own message board, but then again you need people to show up too. Always a problem, that.

I have always maintained some type of message forum that was connected with my website. This has been true since 1998, and it goes through phases as far as traffic is concerned. The difference between Juliann and myself is that I don't hide out at a particular forum where I can operate in God-mode. I have always spent more time on other forums than I have my own, and you know very well you that I don't delete/edit posts of others as Juliann loves to do at MAD.

[_Pumplehoober]

I have always maintained some type of message forum that was connected with my website. This has been true since 1998, and it goes through phases as far as traffic is concerned. The difference between Juliann and myself is that I don't hide out at a particular forum where I can operate in God-mode. I have always spent more time on other forums than I have my own, and you know very well you that I don't delete/edit posts of others as Juliann loves to do at MAD.

Your presence on other message board is precisely because yours are abysmal failures and it is impossible to get your ego stroked without people to stroke it. You have had posts here removed here and you know it. What makes you mad is not that you have it so bad, but that others have it so good.

[_dartagnan]

Your presence on other message board is precisely because yours are abysmal failures

Failure according to whom? The forums have always served their purposes.

and it is impossible to get your ego stroked without people to stroke it.

How in the world does operating a forum, stroke an ego?

You have had posts here removed here and you know it.

Here? On MD? I suppose it’s possible, though I don’t recall any. But we aren’t talking about MD are we. I said on my forum posts do not get arbitrarily deleted or edited, while I am moderator. Contrast this with the Juliann forum.

Tradd, I’m at a loss here. You seem to consider it a “problem” that my forums have never generated the traffic that FAIR has.

This is a problem for whom, exactly? It certainly is not a problem for me.

What makes you mad is not that you have it so bad, but that others have it so good.

I’m “mad” about my forums? Pray tell, what is your evidence for that?

The only reason I started the forum last year was because the Shades forum was on hiatus for a month, and people were getting banned from FAIR left and right. During that time the forum was pretty busy. Unfortunately, it was during a month when I didn’t have much time to moderate it so I used the same moderators here to run my forum for me. When this forum was up and running again we all moved back over here.

A year or so before that, I started up the forum as an alternative spot for people to talk about Islamic issues since it became a red flagged topic at FAIR. My forum at that time was by invitation only, which undermines your theory that I wanted as many participants as possible. And as you well know, there were about a dozen or so posters from FAIR who came on over and accepted the invitation – some requested an invitation. But we all shared the same perspective so there was little reason to debate each other. The exchanges between you and I constituted most of the action on that forum. After you fled the scene I decided to close it down.

So what’s the problem?

by the way, that last comment was a Jack Nicholson line from one of my favorite movies.

Edit: Here is a post I found. I posted it at FAIR about two years ago I think. It was in response to the FAIR mods moaning and groaning about problems maintaining the board:

I ran a popular message forum back in 1997 and hated it because I was the only moderator. Someone actually cracked into it and changed the forum without me knowing about it. I only showed up once every few days, and it got so not worth it that I shut it down. So I can empathize with the mods here, especially since they operate with a strict policy. I then spent the next couple of years on anti boards like Walter Martin and CARM, until ZLMB popped into existence.

Nowadays I think most faithful LDS online choose between FAIR or ZLMB. ZLMB caught fire when it first started up. A few years ago that was the place to be if you wanted to witness the best debates and informed discussions from both sides. The archive there is an absolute treasure trove.

But at some point ZLMB began to tick some Mormons off and they started to migrate over to FAIR. I believe even Dan Peterson - who operates freely here in "God mode" (jargon for PC gamers)- was reprimanded by the moderaters there for breaking a rule. And to their credit, the Mods allowed a section for people to complain about the mods. The mod team consisted of LDS, Catholics, Protestants, and even Brent Metcalfe. A vote was held before any action was taken.

It was probably the best place to go if you're looking for a "level playing field." By contrast, FAIR is strictly for LDS, and I would say, even a certain type of LDS. Sure, it is not a "fair" environment but they'll be the first to admit it. I'm not sure they're even interested in trying to be objective, but that is their thing now. High profile posters are given protected status, which makes them feel totally at ease, but it makes it difficult for others who are tempted to engage in any discussion with them, since, at any point they express the slightest frustration, the mods come in and save the day by closing down the thread before any responses can take place. So here at FAIR, I wouldn't count on any memorable exchanges like those that decorate the wall of fame at ZLMB. Passion and zeal are interpreted as hostility and agenda-driven here at FAIR. Any discussion that doesn't produce passionate opinions from both ends of the spectrum, probably aren't worth discussing anyway. Which is probably why I think some of the best discussions were those that were eventually closed. Maybe that is just me.

Anyway, I started a forum recently to divert the "unpleasant" Islam exchanges over there. There are a couple dozen registered posters from here and ZLMB, but they are primarily posters who, like BCSpace, share my views, so there is hardly any debate going on. Antis don't want to go where liberal Mormons hang out. They'd rather antagonize the Peter Priesthoods for kicks and giggles. So they come here, insult the thin-skinned and hypersensitive, get put on the que, and either leave for good or return under different names. ZLMB now seems to be a weird mix of people more inclined to talk about politics than religion. It has suffered a great deal since FAIR started sheltering LDS apologists with privileged status.

I'll be focusing on quality in my forum, not quantity. I haven't advertised it on google and I don't plan on it. Participants will be hand selected through invitation, or they can email me if they want to register. Right now I've only invited LDS, but they don't have anything to argue about amongst themselves.

Aside from the occasional Tradd Button appearance and Dale, Woody Brison and P. Osbourne talking about the Book of Abraham, the forum is pretty much dead. But that is how I want it for now until I have time to develop it more. I'll be bringing in some "critics" I've come to respect over the years. Maybe it'll amount to something through time. But I will not be censoring people unless they're swearing or posting vulgar photos. Aside from that, I'm a firm believer that adults should be able to moderate themselves.

This was my attitude then, and it is the same attitude I hold now.

PS: I suppose you and Levi went on vacation together? Odd that the two of you disappear together and then show up together.

[_rcrocket]

What board is that?

[_dartagnan]

What board is that?

You should know. You signed up using two different names, though you only posted a few times,.

[_Pumplehoober]

Failure according to whom? The forums have always served their purposes.

Well if you mean the purpose is to provide a forum for your own ranting, then yes it is a wonderful success.

Do you realize how entertaining your paranoia is?

It is odd that if you look at your profile

http://www.mormondiscussions.com/discus ... fd128089b3

it says you have 503 posts (right now).

Click on the “Find all posts…” and it displays 505 posts. There is a glitch in the search function. You had two posts deleted because you said something stupid. Nothing is displayed under your profile, but retained somewhere in the database. I saw one, since it was about how you did not agree with something you said. I do not know what the other is, but it is entertaining nonetheless.

Kevin you know as well as I that you desperately need your ego stroked. You left Mormonism because you were no longer told how great you were and you are a critic now precisely because other critics here lavish you with praise. Pretend all you like, but you know the truth, as do I.

[_Jersey Girl]

More off topic nonsense. Would you guys mind starting your own mutual hate threads? This one was intended to be positive.

[_Dr. Shades]

You have had posts here removed here and you know it. . . Click on the “Find all posts…” and it displays 505 posts. There is a glitch in the search function. You had two posts deleted because you said something stupid.

That's not true. I've never deleted a post by Kevin Graham (or anyone else) here. Edited, yes, but deleted, no.

Well, maybe it's partially true: There's no way for a person to delete his/her own posts, so quite often you'll see a completely empty post with nothing more than "Oops" or "Mods please delete" or "comment deleted." In that case, I respect their wishes (and make the board look nicer) by erasing those.

Nothing is displayed under your profile, but retained somewhere in the database.

That might be a glitch in and of itself, since I thought that Kevin had deleted his posts (and the deletion was then deleted by me) more than twice. But perhaps I'm wrong.

I saw one, since it was about how you did not agree with something you said. I do not know what the other is, but it is entertaining nonetheless.

That doesn't sound familiar. I wouldn't have deleted something substantive like that. Perhaps he's referring to his FAIR article which he requested they take down?

Kevin you know as well as I that you desperately need your ego stroked. You left Mormonism because you were no longer told how great you were and you are a critic now precisely because other critics here lavish you with praise. Pretend all you like, but you know the truth, as do I.

Tell me: Do Muslims hate being told what they believe to the same extent that Mormons hate being told what they believe?

[_dartagnan]

Click on the “Find all posts…” and it displays 505 posts. There is a glitch in the search function. You had two posts deleted because you said something stupid.

This is a lie. I have asked the moderator to delete some of my posts because of a double-post, but I have never had a post removed because I said something “stupid.” At least not to my knowledge.

But hey, who needs to do research when one can simply scroll a search engine, take notes and then leap to illicit conclusions? Was this the standard methodology they taught you in Cairo?

Nothing is displayed under your profile, but retained somewhere in the database.

Nice going Sherlock Button. And from this you have rightful cause to conclude I had been edited for saying “something stupid”?

I saw one, since it was about how you did not agree with something you said. I do not know what the other is, but it is entertaining nonetheless.

Keep pretending you’re here for entertainment purposes. You lurk on Mormon forums yet discuss nothing about Mormonism. You merely try to pick fights with me on ridiculous matters that involve little more than your psychoanalysis of the stuff that makes me who I am. You’re a second-rate Muslim Wade Englund.

Kevin you know as well as I that you desperately need your ego stroked.

Another argument via assertion? Show some evidence for once in your life. I provided an old post that explained the purpose of my forum and what I expected from it, before it ever got off the ground. It all undermined your little psychoanalytical rant. You could have read it beforehand but you’re never interested in knowing what you’re talking about. Why bother yourself with the facts when you’re content with your own hate driven perception of me? The concept of me you apparently need to be true.

You left Mormonism because you were no longer told how great you were and you are a critic now precisely because other critics here lavish you with praise.

I notice you decided to avoid the refutation of this assertion from last month, and maintain the falsehood. Ignorance is bliss, huh? The evidence indicates the opposite, but again, we’re not dealing with someone who is interested in knowing what he is talking about. Your sole purpose on these forums is to stalk and attack me.

Anyone who thinks my move to the critic side has anything to do with ego stroking, needs to have his/her head examined. I knew exactly what I was getting into, and popularity was hardly a benefit. I'd ask you to produce evidence but we already know you don't do that. That requires minimal effort and the employment of a few brain cells. You're not interested. For crying out loud, you still haven't provided the "quotes" you claimed were from me last month.

Pretend all you like, but you know the truth, as do I.

I know you seriously need counseling.