Joseph's Swamp

[_beastie]

D. Michael Quinn, New Mormon History, Ch.5, p.79

In an 1841 letter to Hotchkiss Smith fumed, "I presume you are no stranger to the part of the city plot we bought of you being a sickly hole [and] although we have been keeping up appearances, and holding out inducements to encourage immigration . . . we scarcely think it justifiable in consequence of the mortality that almost invariably awaits those who come." This was one of the rare occasions when Smith did not "keep up appearances" as all real estate promoters must do and alluded to one of Nauvoo's great problems. Endemic malaria was the worst natural scourge of the Mississippi Basin, and Smith had located his town on a wet river bottomland that swarmed in summer with infected mosquitoes. The plague was an annual event of the hot season, and hundreds died, victims of the "unhealthy air." Draining the area helped, but new settlers in particular remained susceptible to infection by mosquitoes breeding in nearby islands and sloughs.

[_Jersey Girl]

beastie

The problem is that you, as Bob, have only asserted that this was enough time for adequate improvement to justify Joseph Smith's statement. Neither of you have provided evidence to support this assertion.

I've provided that the malaria outbreaks lasted 3 summers. What evidence are you looking for? You can look it up on any number of internet sites.

[_beastie]

I've provided that the malaria outbreaks lasted 3 summers. What evidence are you looking for? You can look it up on any number of internet sites.

Where did you provide the evidence of that assertion? I must have missed a post of yours somewhere. This assertion contradicts other contemporary statements, such as the one I provided on page one, which clearly stated that the deaths continued.

[_Jersey Girl]

I've provided that the malaria outbreaks lasted 3 summers. What evidence are you looking for? You can look it up on any number of internet sites.

Where did you provide the evidence of that assertion? I must have missed a post of yours somewhere. This assertion contradicts other contemporary statements, such as the one I provided on page one, which clearly stated that the deaths continued.

You can google it, beastie.

[_beastie]

Here's another record that contradicts your assertion that the malaria outbreaks only lasted three years:

http://www.rnsmith.com/wpsmith/chron.html

By October 1846 Nauvoo was a virtual ghost town. Visitors to the area record it as such in their writings.

Mary and one or two children had been suffering from malaria or 'fever' (as the pioneers called it) and couldn't leave. The mob had hired William to clean out the "poisoned" wells for the new inhabitants of the city. They thought the Mormons had poisoned all the wells when they left. Many deaths occurred during this time from malaria. The "Nauvoo Neighbor" a community newspaper listed many deaths of children and elderly especially during this year.

[_beastie]

You can google it, beastie.

You said you provided the evidence, Jersey.

Between this round and the previous times I discussed this, I have spent quite a bit of time googling information on this topic. I've been providing quite a bit of source citation on this thread. I don't think it's too much to ask that you share what you said you already shared on this thread.

[_rcrocket]

I guess if you keep repeating yourself, Trix, you'll convince the already convinced. Apostacy breeds deception.

Hotchkiss saw the value of the site and was a "city-building" speculator himself, mapping out a city. His site was unique, in that it was virtually the only low-level flat area adjacent to the river for many miles, making it prime for river-traffic business. (One only need look at Keokuk and Davenport and other major Iowa cities to see what this means). But, he couldn't attract settlers and sold it to the Mormons, albeit, for a high price in comparison to adjacent tracts. The Mormons paid a high price because they knew its value.

But the cure was drainage. "Gradually this land was drained, the Saints were persuaded to use water from deep wells instead of surface water, and the scourge of fever began to disappear. Advertisements for pills and powders that would surely cure "chills and fever" no longer appeared with such frequency on the last page of the Times and Seasons." Inez Smith Davis, "The Story of the Church," chapter 31.

In terms of the claim that the river has now reclaimed large parts of the City, one only need compare Leonard's maps in his Nauvoo book to current mapping to put the lie to that canard. The Smith homestead is the same distance today as it was in 1843, to the river.

And, no, I am not impressed with Google scholarship, nor your practice of citing sources you don't have. I will start calling you out on the practice.

[_truth dancer]

Apostacy breeds deception.

I don't know what to do with this...

Just when I think I can't be surprised by believers on a message board, I am.

Wow!

(sigh)

~dancer~

[_beastie]

I guess if you keep repeating yourself, Trix, you'll convince the already convinced. Apostacy breeds deception.

Hotchkiss saw the value of the site and was a "city-building" speculator himself, mapping out a city. His site was unique, in that it was virtually the only low-level flat area adjacent to the river for many miles, making it prime for river-traffic business. (One only need look at Keokuk and Davenport and other major Iowa cities to see what this means). But, he couldn't attract settlers and sold it to the Mormons, albeit, for a high price in comparison to adjacent tracts. The Mormons paid a high price because they knew its value.

But the cure was drainage. "Gradually this land was drained, the Saints were persuaded to use water from deep wells instead of surface water, and the scourge of fever began to disappear. Advertisements for pills and powders that would surely cure "chills and fever" no longer appeared with such frequency on the last page of the Times and Seasons." Inez Smith Davis, "The Story of the Church," chapter 31.

In terms of the claim that the river has now reclaimed large parts of the City, one only need compare Leonard's maps in his Nauvoo book to current mapping to put the lie to that canard. The Smith homestead is the same distance today as it was in 1843, to the river.

And, no, I am not impressed with Google scholarship, nor your practice of citing sources you don't have. I will start calling you out on the practice.

Your hubris no longer surprises me, Bob, after your similar performance on the Book of Mormon horse thread. You beat your chest and behave as if you have provided firm evidence of your assertion that only a deceptive person would deny, and yet reality is that you provide very little to support your assertions.

The majority of the texts I have cited on this thread are from the Mormon studies cd, which I do own, and where I obtained the information. So if you want to "call me out" on the practice of citing sources you don't think I have, go right ahead.

Once again, there are two issues that I've been trying to address. Some have attempted to conflate the two, but I have not.

1) Joseph Smith, by his own admission, tried to induce settlers to purchase land that he called a sickly death hole, as recorded in 1841. All the tap dancing about how the draining eventually helped doesn't address this issue, and it's not going away just because you like to bluster and huff and puff.

Joseph Smith himself said that he was inducing the settlers to purchase land that he knew was a sickly death hole, and that could very well lead to mortality. I provided additional sources - from a source I own, by the way, mormonstudiesCD - that demonstrate what that inducement was - sending out representatives - either Granger or the 12 apostles - to convince the "saints abroad" to either purchase or trade their lands for the Nauvoo property. The inducement was his religious influence.

2) In 1843, Joseph Smith now told newcomers, "in the name of the Lord", that the bottomlands were the healthiest. Both you and Jersey Girl have simply asserted that, by then, the problem had been fixed, without providing evidence of that assertion. On the other hand, I've provided two separate sources that both referenced the continued problem of what we now know was malaria.

You're full of hot air, Bob, and very little substance, and I am going to call you out on that.

[_beastie]

And here's yet another source:

It Still Takes Faith

BRENT L. TOP

Brent L. Top is an associate dean of Religious Education at BYU.
This devotional address was given on 22 July 1997 in the de Jong Concert Hall.

©1997 by Brigham Young University. All rights reserved.

After the death of the Prophet Joseph, the Saints were directed by President Brigham Young to redouble their efforts in working on the temple so they could receive the saving ordinances of the gospel therein. These covenants and blessings would be a guiding influence and a strengthening and sustaining power to the Saints as they faced the hardships of their journey. "Let the fire of the covenant which you made in the House of the Lord burn in your hearts," President Brigham Young urged the pioneers ("Journal History of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints," 28 September 1846, p. 5). Those pioneers we honor this sesquicentennial year had a "fire of faith" and a commitment to covenants that led them across the plains to a promised land just as surely as the cloud by day and pillar of fire by night led the ancient Israelites on their journey.

One such pioneer who was guided by the "fire of the covenant" was Stillman Pond. He and his family were among the last to leave Nauvoo in September 1846. Having already endured much persecution and harassment from the enemies of the Church, the Pond family was ultimately driven from their Nauvoo home at the point of a bayonet. Without adequate preparation for their trek, they were left without proper food, clothing, and shelter. Their trek across Iowa to Winter Quarters was fraught with almost unimaginable suffering and heartache.

Snow came early to the Iowa territory that year, making travel extremely difficult. Weakened from trudging through the deep snow, Stillman's pregnant wife, Maria, who had already been afflicted with consumption, then contracted malaria. She, along with every member of her family, suffered greatly from this sickness. Bowed down with grief and aching from the pain and fever of malaria, Maria could no longer walk. Amidst these grim circumstances she gave birth to twin boys who were named Joseph and Hyrum. They both died only a few days later. The deaths of these children coming across the plains from Nauvoo to Winter Quarters were only the beginning of the sacrifice and trials of Stillman Pond.

With all of the members of the Pond family sick with malaria, Stillman, who was unable to walk or even sit up, lay on his stomach in the bed of his wagon. Bracing himself with one arm and extending his other over the dashboard to hold the reins, he drove his team the last 150 miles. On October 16, 1846, they arrived at Winter Quarters. During the winter there the Pond family continued to suffer. In the space of five days, three more children died. A sixth died a few weeks later:

Laura Jane Pond, age 14, died of "chills and fever" on December 2, 1846.

Harriet M. Pond, age 11, died "with chills" on December 4.

Abigail A. Pond, age 18, died "with chills" on December 7.

Lyman Pond, age 6, died with "chills and fever" on January 15, 1847.