Mister Scratch wrote:I'm trying to decide which is preferable, Ray: your violent, sociopathic "rager" posts, or your completely substance-free "look what a rube I am!" posts. Your lack of maturity is quite striking, mate.
I'd go for the "rager" posts. That way, you can pin me much more easily.
by the way, what is your name, again? I might have missed it the first time.
Mister Scratch wrote:I'm trying to decide which is preferable, Ray: your violent, sociopathic "rager" posts, or your completely substance-free "look what a rube I am!" posts. Your lack of maturity is quite striking, mate.
I'd go for the "rager" posts. That way, you can pin me much more easily.
by the way, what is your name, again? I might have missed it the first time.
I wonder how Sorensen, Peterson, Hamblin, et al. feel about their scholarly theories being pimped out for profit like this. The guys running these tours probably have an Amway business on the side.
"We of this Church do not rely on any man-made statement concerning the nature of Deity. Our knowledge comes directly from the personal experience of Joseph Smith." - Gordon B. Hinckley
"It's wrong to criticize leaders of the Mormon Church even if the criticism is true." - Dallin H. Oaks
This is one of the silliest threads ever to appear on the board. At least as long as I have been here. I wouldn't put it past you guys to get even silier than this, though.
People go on tours and cruises. For fun. I went to Alaska. I had a great time. Spent a bunch of money. Was I "taken?" Were those cruise operators "dishonest?" They promised me a great time and I had one. Enough said.
I saw nothing in the material you posted which promised anything more than speculation. But people enjoy speculating. Were I to go on such a tour, I would come home happy that maybe I had seen something of the Nephite world. But I certainly would not go around bragging I had walked the actual streets of Zarahemla.
Another unique distinction is that we concentrate our studies to the Mesoamerican region (southern Mexico, Guatemala, Belize, and the Yucatan Peninsula), where well known LDS archaeologists and scholars propose many Book of Mormon sites. Using the scriptures and scholarly studies as our guide, together we discover those mountain barriers, wilderness regions, waterways and great seas that play such a significant role in the history of the Jaredites, Nephites and Lamanites.
Notice the word I bolded. This is where they have designated their loophole. These are proposed Book of Mormon sites.
Now, I suppose that there will be some naïve LDS folks who may come away from the tour thinking they have seen the actual Book of Mormon sites, but I have to agree with Charity on this one.
Any time you take a cruise, tour, etc., the situation should be "buyer beware". It is your job as the consumer to gather as much information on what you are going to experience as possible. I know that before I plunk my hard earned cash down on something, that's what I do.
charity wrote:This is one of the silliest threads ever to appear on the board. At least as long as I have been here. I wouldn't put it past you guys to get even silier than this, though.
People go on tours and cruises. For fun. I went to Alaska. I had a great time. Spent a bunch of money. Was I "taken?" Were those cruise operators "dishonest?" They promised me a great time and I had one. Enough said.
I saw nothing in the material you posted which promised anything more than speculation. But people enjoy speculating. Were I to go on such a tour, I would come home happy that maybe I had seen something of the Nephite world. But I certainly would not go around bragging I had walked the actual streets of Zarahemla.
Get a grip.
As long as these things are presented in terms of "what ifs," I don't see a problem with it. People go on trips to look at Tara from Gone with the Wind, even though it is a place in a novel. Obviously, I would not go on a Book of Mormon tour in Central America, because I think the whole idea of a historical Book of Mormon is preposterous, but if that is your thing, I can't see it doing too much harm.
“I was hooked from the start,” Snoop Dogg said. “We talked about the purpose of life, played Mousetrap, and ate brownies. The kids thought it was off the hook, for real.”
charity wrote:This is one of the silliest threads ever to appear on the board. At least as long as I have been here. I wouldn't put it past you guys to get even silier than this, though.
People go on tours and cruises. For fun. I went to Alaska. I had a great time. Spent a bunch of money. Was I "taken?" Were those cruise operators "dishonest?" They promised me a great time and I had one. Enough said.
I saw nothing in the material you posted which promised anything more than speculation. But people enjoy speculating. Were I to go on such a tour, I would come home happy that maybe I had seen something of the Nephite world. But I certainly would not go around bragging I had walked the actual streets of Zarahemla.
Get a grip.
Come now Charity. Surely you have to admit that since they are making it a point to view Stela 5, a VERY thoroughly debunked piece of Book of Mormon "archeology", there is some dishonesty going on there.
They also talk about Stela 10.
...where we will analyze Kaminaljuyu’s stela 10, an altar that dates to 147 BC and may suggest a transfer of kingship from King Noah to Limhi (see Mosiah 18 & 19)
I've never heard of this. Does anyone have any information on this?
If there's one thing I've learned from this board, it's that consensual sex with multiple partners is okay unless God commands it. - Abman
I find this place to be hostile toward all brands of stupidity. That's why I like it. - Some Schmo
charity wrote: People go on tours and cruises. For fun. I went to Alaska. I had a great time. Spent a bunch of money. Was I "taken?" Were those cruise operators "dishonest?" They promised me a great time and I had one. Enough said.
I saw nothing in the material you posted which promised anything more than speculation. But people enjoy speculating. Were I to go on such a tour, I would come home happy that maybe I had seen something of the Nephite world. But I certainly would not go around bragging I had walked the actual streets of Zarahemla.
Get a grip.
This is fine and dandy, but the tour is sold under false pretenses, and it certainly wouldn't be purchased as much if it weren't sold the way it is. It's a deception any way you slice it, whether they come away from it having had a good time or not.
God belief is for people who don't want to live life on the universe's terms.
Another unique distinction is that we concentrate our studies to the Mesoamerican region (southern Mexico, Guatemala, Belize, and the Yucatan Peninsula), where well known LDS archaeologists and scholars propose many Book of Mormon sites. Using the scriptures and scholarly studies as our guide, together we discover those mountain barriers, wilderness regions, waterways and great seas that play such a significant role in the history of the Jaredites, Nephites and Lamanites.
Notice the word I bolded. This is where they have designated their loophole. These are proposed Book of Mormon sites.
Now, I suppose that there will be some naïve LDS folks who may come away from the tour thinking they have seen the actual Book of Mormon sites, but I have to agree with Charity on this one.
Any time you take a cruise, tour, etc., the situation should be "buyer beware". It is your job as the consumer to gather as much information on what you are going to experience as possible. I know that before I plunk my hard earned cash down on something, that's what I do.
"Proposed" to whom, Liz? As I demonstrated in my other thread, these "proposals" lack the patina of proper scholarship and academic study. It's not the same as signing up of a tour in Arizona, say, where scientists "propose" that the Anasazi had dwellings. Besides, according to the only extant Michael Watson Letter, the Book of Mormon took place up in Northern America.
charity wrote:Were I to go on such a tour, I would come home happy that maybe I had seen something of the Nephite world. But I certainly would not go around bragging I had walked the actual streets of Zarahemla.
Oh come on, Charity. There is no maybe about it. If you went on one of these tours you would know with every fiber of your being that you saw the Nephite world. I've talked to people who've gone on these tours. They have a testimony that the things they saw were "true." They even have pictures to prove it.
"We of this Church do not rely on any man-made statement concerning the nature of Deity. Our knowledge comes directly from the personal experience of Joseph Smith." - Gordon B. Hinckley
"It's wrong to criticize leaders of the Mormon Church even if the criticism is true." - Dallin H. Oaks