Internet time line / Critical & Apologetic development.

[_Maxrep]

I have been curious about church related material becoming established on the internet. How quickly did sites critical of the church surface? Which notable ones were these? How about apologetic sites? Also, does anyone here remember the participation levels of these sites after they had been around for a year or so? How about current participation levels?

Hopefully there are a few here on this board who have been pretty active on the internet since the mid 90's. Would it be possible for some of you guys to throw out some dates? Just a little time line sketching a picture of how both critical and apologetic forums have grown as well as levels of member participation?

My guess is that member exposure to new information about the LDS church, has grown at a phenomenal rate in recent years. For many individuals it seems that it is quite difficult to keep up a good game face at church for more than a few years of carrying significant doubts. Remember that game called 'Booby Trap'? In a way I view many wards like the structure of the game. One by one, stalwart testimonies are being pulled or weakened. Sure the members may still attend or not, but they no longer serve as a load bearing spiritual pillar. Some questioning members do chat with other close member friends in their ward, some do not. Maybe a better description is Osteoporosis of the church's supporting structure, as it is basically being hollowed out.

[_Mister Scratch]

I have been curious about church related material becoming established on the internet. How quickly did sites critical of the church surface? Which notable ones were these? How about apologetic sites? Also, does anyone here remember the participation levels of these sites after they had been around for a year or so? How about current participation levels?

Hopefully there are a few here on this board who have been pretty active on the internet since the mid 90's. Would it be possible for some of you guys to throw out some dates? Just a little time line sketching a picture of how both critical and apologetic forums have grown as well as levels of member participation?

Hi, Maxrep. I have not been around as long as some of the other folks on here, though I have made a kind of hobby of "researching" the history of online Mormonism. I believe that there are a few key sites that are really worthy of mention. Sure, there have probably been dozens---if not hundreds---of both pro- and anti-sites, but to my mind, the really key ones are/were:
---ZLMB
---FAIR
---RfM
---MAD
---(briefly) Kevin Graham's board
---SHIELDS
---The Mormon Curtain

I'm sure that others will chime on on this, but to my mind, these site have been quite critical insofar as they are the sort of "battlegrounds" where critical Mormon-related issues have played out.

My guess is that member exposure to new information about the LDS church, has grown at a phenomenal rate in recent years.

Yes, there's no doubt about that. One can sense a bit of panic amongst the Brethren, and amongst Mopologists and the huge proliferation of stuff on the Internet. Mormon officials have always tried very hard to control the flow of information ("Some kinds of truth aren't very useful"), and thus the Web is a big thorn in their side. Do you recall that tidbit on the BYU page mentioning that the Church monitors "1,500 anti-Mormon websites"?

[_CaliforniaKid]

The UTLM forum was one of the first hotbeds of ciritcal/apologetic engagement. They then retreated to ZLMB to escape pro-critic bias amng the moderators. The Mormons on ZLMB later retreated to the FAIR boards under the guidance of their prophet-leader, Juliann. FAIR eventually excommunicated its forums from the organization, leaving Juliann in charge of a schismatic apologetic board called MADB.

If you're really interested in early sites critical of Mormonism, one place to look might be the Internet Wayback Machine at www.archive.org. I'm not sure how far back it goes. A few early critic sites I remember were www.mormonism-web.com and of course the infamous www.utlm.org.

[_Mister Scratch]

The UTLM forum was one of the first hotbeds of ciritcal/apologetic engagement. They then retreated to ZLMB to escape pro-critic bias amng the moderators. The Mormons on ZLMB later retreated to the FAIR boards under the guidance of their prophet-leader, Juliann. FAIR eventually excommunicated its forums from the organization, leaving Juliann in charge of a schismatic apologetic board called MADB.

If you're really interested in early sites critical of Mormonism, one place to look might be the Internet Wayback Machine at www.archive.org. I'm not sure how far back it goes. A few early critic sites I remember were www.mormonism-web.com and of course the infamous www.utlm.org.

Ah, yes! Thank you, CK. Indeed, the UTLM board was very important early on. Thank you for filling in the history, CK.

[_Maxrep]

Thanks for the forum listings. How about View From the Foyer? Did we have anyone hear posting on that forum, or was it on the smaller side? Also, what kind of costs are incurred on a monthly basis with a message board like this one for example?

[_moksha]

It would be great if in a hundred years from now someone at Columbia University could write a web book on the History Timeline of Mormon Apologetics and Criticisms.

They could have interesting graphics on the timeline for the birth of Hugh Nibley and Daniel C. Peterson. Maybe a graphic also for Mr. Scratch.

[_beastie]

I've been online participating in Mormon related topics since the summer of 1996, If I recall correctly. This was shortly after Eric started the RFM email group, which eventually evolved into the BB.

The important event that preceded that development, which predated my participation, was the AOL religion folders. There was a folder devoted to Mormonism in particular, I'm not sure how that folder was subsetted, but apparently there was a folder for both believers and exbelievers (maybe more). Both exmormons and Mormons participated, and each felt constantly harassed by the other group. I was not online at that time and can't provide even a subjective analysis of what occurred, but I do know that the reason Eric started the email group was because believers wouldn't stop defending the faith in the exmormon folder (or whatever it was called, I believe it was called a "folder"). I believe that was the impetus behind one of the most controversial RFM guidelines, ie, that defense of the faith is forbidden.

[_CaliforniaKid]

Speaking of Eric, www.mrm.org is another critical site that's been around as far back as I can remember.

[_Bond...James Bond]

Direct debate (both between Apologists and Religious critics and apologists and secular critics)

email groups?--->UTLM--->ZLMB--->FAIR/MAAD-->MDB (although MAAD still is highly active...)

Christian/Apologetic Debate boards
CARM is the only one I know of (Bob Betts has one that was mentioned alot at MAD)

Support boards (supposedly less defense of faith)
RFM (96/97 to present) (most popular)
New Order Mormon board
View from the Foyer
exmormon forums