Christmas and Smithmas Combo a bad idea...

[_Trevor]

I think Mormons are first and foremost Christians.

And that means they should cater to your Smith-free Christmas desires?

[_moksha]

What were the hymns to Joseph Smith?

Charity, we had "Praise to the Man", "We Named Him Joseph" and "Joseph Smith's First Prayer" plus a devotional narative. Those are all fine songs, but of course, it is Christmas time and our thoughts should turn to Christ.

I must say that was over the top. I can't see having even one song about Joseph Smith. I don't know "We Named Him Joseph." We out here in the "mission field" always did think you Utah Mormons are strange. I think I would go to the bishop on this.

The Bishop was there smiling approvingly. I have no desire to place my head in a noose with my local ward. It may result in another MAD-like banishment from my ward.

[_krose]

Hey, at least Joseph's actual birthday is Dec 23. I think the consensus is that the nativity as described in the New Testament would not have been in December. They co-opted the existing Pagan holiday. Why don't LDS celebrate Christmas on April 6, which is the 'revealed' date, isn't it?

[_charity]

Hey, at least Joseph's actual birthday is Dec 23. I think the consensus is that the nativity as described in the New Testament would not have been in December. They co-opted the existing Pagan holiday. Why don't LDS celebrate Christmas on April 6, which is the 'revealed' date, isn't it?

Who says we don't? Some of remember the date as the nativity, but that is rather overshadowed, since that is also supposed to be the date of the resurrection.

[_The Nehor]

What were the hymns to Joseph Smith?

Charity, we had "Praise to the Man", "We Named Him Joseph" and "Joseph Smith's First Prayer" plus a devotional narative. Those are all fine songs, but of course, it is Christmas time and our thoughts should turn to Christ.

I must say that was over the top. I can't see having even one song about Joseph Smith. I don't know "We Named Him Joseph." We out here in the "mission field" always did think you Utah Mormons are strange. I think I would go to the bishop on this.

Maybe this is a Utah thing. We sang several Christmas songs today. The Bishopric spoke on the Nativity. Sunday School was an open discussion about the Life of Christ dividing his life into sections. Priesthood was about the nature of miracles. The only mention of Joseph was in discussion of blessing children in Sunday School and how while Joseph blessed a few and was exhausted afterwards the Savior in 3 Nephi blessed hundreds.

One more reason never to move to Utah. I'll add that to how angry several LDS I know got about the commentators during the BYU-UCLA game. They claimed that they were anti-BYU and anti-Church.

[_Trevor]

Hey, at least Joseph's actual birthday is Dec 23. I think the consensus is that the nativity as described in the New Testament would not have been in December. They co-opted the existing Pagan holiday. Why don't LDS celebrate Christmas on April 6, which is the 'revealed' date, isn't it?

Too bad that Oracles and Talismans: Joseph Smith as a Renaissance Magus was never published. I think Compton may have been the author. It discusses all of the significant dates in Joseph Smith's life lining up with the dates of Jewish festivals, equinoxes, and solstices. Quite a breathtaking work of bologna, but fun too. Through it you can see how Smith's life could be mythologized in much the same way Jesus' has been.

[_krose]

Hey, at least Joseph's actual birthday is Dec 23. I think the consensus is that the nativity as described in the New Testament would not have been in December. They co-opted the existing Pagan holiday. Why don't LDS celebrate Christmas on April 6, which is the 'revealed' date, isn't it?

Who says we don't? Some of remember the date as the nativity, but that is rather overshadowed, since that is also supposed to be the date of the resurrection.

Nobody ever did that I knew of in my first 28 years in the church. Sure, people mentioned it now and then, but I always thought, during my LDS years, that we should have moved the entire celebration to April and ignored December, just to show the world we were different and knew the real truth. That would be a commitment to revealed truth and not just going along with the crowd because everybody else is doing it.

What I'm saying is that JSjr has a better claim to a December celebration than Jesus of Nazareth.

[_Infymus]

Today at my ward we had a musical Christmas program during Sacrament Meeting. What was unusual is that half the musical
numbers and narration were Christmas hymns and devotion to Christ and the other half were musical numbers about and devotion
to Joseph Smith.

That seemed horribly wrong to me. I wanted to clench my fists in angry rage. Instead, I just shook my head. I know Joseph Smith's
Birthday is on the 23rd, but it seems totally inappropriate to mix him into a program that should have been devoted to the Savior at
Christmas.

I know many TBM defenders monitor this site, so this appeal is to them: Let us not mix the two. Many holidays are celebrated on alternate days.
Why don't we take the Sunday before the Christmas program and make that into Joseph Sunday. From start to finish it could be a total
devotional to Joseph Smith.

For me, Christmas should be about Christ and I do not think he should have to share with Joseph Smith.

LOL, nothing like a little Merry Smithmas, right? But according to Nehor and Jason Bourne and a couple others, only crappy members teach and are taught too much emphasis on Joseph Smith.

What I'm saying is that JSjr has a better claim to a December celebration than Jesus of Nazareth.

I rest my case.

[_Jason Bourne]

Today at my ward we had a musical Christmas program during Sacrament Meeting. What was unusual is that half the musical
numbers and narration were Christmas hymns and devotion to Christ and the other half were musical numbers about and devotion
to Joseph Smith.

That seemed horribly wrong to me. I wanted to clench my fists in angry rage. Instead, I just shook my head. I know Joseph Smith's
Birthday is on the 23rd, but it seems totally inappropriate to mix him into a program that should have been devoted to the Savior at
Christmas.

I know many TBM defenders monitor this site, so this appeal is to them: Let us not mix the two. Many holidays are celebrated on alternate days.
Why don't we take the Sunday before the Christmas program and make that into Joseph Sunday. From start to finish it could be a total
devotional to Joseph Smith.

For me, Christmas should be about Christ and I do not think he should have to share with Joseph Smith.

What were the hymns to Joseph Smith?

Charity, we had "Praise to the Man", "We Named Him Joseph" and "Joseph Smith's First Prayer" plus a devotional narative. Those are all fine songs, but of course, it is Christmas time and our thoughts should turn to Christ.

I think that was pretty bad form. In my ward we did not even remember that Dec 23 was Joseph Smith's Bday. We had a beautiful program that was all Christ centered. Very uplifting. We also have a Christmas Eve service tonight.

[_Jason Bourne]

LOL, nothing like a little Merry Smithmas, right? But according to Nehor and Jason Bourne and a couple others, only crappy members teach and are taught too much emphasis on Joseph Smith.

If I recall I the conversation was that I found your claim that you were taught to WORSHIP Joseph Smith dubious. I never said Smith was not emphasized. Of course he is. He is the considered the prophet of the restoration. Without Joseph Smith there is no LDS Church. How can one teach Mormonism without empasizing the founding prophet to some degree?