Missionaries & the Internet

[_Jersey Girl]

Misery

You can't compare missionaries and disciples of Christ as the same thing Jersey Girl.

Of course I can. Who else would you like to compare them to, Misery? As you know, I'm not LDS and I don't support or agree with the theology of the LDS Church. Having said that, comparing LDS missionaries to the disciples of Christ is EXACTLY the same thing philosophically. If you think otherwise, I'd like you to list your reasons for your perspective.

That is like comparing apples and oranges and you know it.

It's comparing missionaries to missionaries.

So you think 110.00 for food in enough for the month?
You try and live 110.00 a month for food and have to rely on others to feed you to make up the difference.

And that is the point, Misery. Missionaries worldwide, depend on the support and assistance of others. LDS missionaries are no different, nor were the disciples of Christ. Again, if you think otherwise, I'd like to see your reasons. As for the $110.00 per month, I assume that LDS subscribe to the ideas presented in the Lillies of the Field. I'll paste a ref for you in this post.

And here it is:

Mat 6:25¶Therefore I say unto you, Take no thought for your life, what ye shall eat, or what ye shall drink; nor yet for your body, what ye shall put on. Is not the life more than meat, and the body than raiment?

Mat 6:26Behold the fowls of the air: for they sow not, neither do they reap, nor gather into barns; yet your heavenly Father feedeth them. Are ye not much better than they?

Mat 6:27Which of you by taking thought can add one cubit unto his stature?

Mat 6:28And why take ye thought for raiment? Consider the lilies of the field, how they grow; they toil not, neither do they spin:

Mat 6:29And yet I say unto you, That even Solomon in all his glory was not arrayed like one of these.

Mat 6:30Wherefore, if God so clothe the grass of the field, which to day is, and to morrow is cast into the oven, [shall he] not much more [clothe] you, O ye of little faith?

Mat 6:31Therefore take no thought, saying, What shall we eat? or, What shall we drink? or, Wherewithal shall we be clothed?

Mat 6:32(For after all these things do the Gentiles seek:) for your heavenly Father knoweth that ye have need of all these things.

Mat 6:33But seek ye first the kingdom of God, and his righteousness; and all these things shall be added unto you.

Mat 6:34Take therefore no thought for the morrow: for the morrow shall take thought for the things of itself. Sufficient unto the day [is] the evil thereof.

Whatever else you or I might think about LDS doctrine and theology, I see LDS missionaries as living out their faith and striving to do so in a Christlike manner. That is to say, with the heart of a servant.

[_Jersey Girl]

Jason,

I'd like you to read my post to Misery above this post and tell me if your thoughts differ from what I've presented. I don't attempt to speak for LDS but as an LDS observer.

Jersey Girl

[_moksha]

I wonder if it would be at the discretion of the Mission President to allow a call to the father in a single parent family?

[_Roger Morrison]

Thanks Jersey Girl, You posted:

Mat 6:25¶Therefore I say unto you, Take no thought for your life, what ye shall eat, or what ye shall drink; nor yet for your body, what ye shall put on. Is not the life more than meat, and the body than raiment?

Mat 6:26Behold the fowls of the air: for they sow not, neither do they reap, nor gather into barns; yet your heavenly Father feedeth them. Are ye not much better than they?

Mat 6:27Which of you by taking thought can add one cubit unto his stature?

Mat 6:28And why take ye thought for raiment? Consider the lilies of the field, how they grow; they toil not, neither do they spin:

Mat 6:29And yet I say unto you, That even Solomon in all his glory was not arrayed like one of these.

Mat 6:30Wherefore, if God so clothe the grass of the field, which to day is, and to morrow is cast into the oven, [shall he] not much more [clothe] you, O ye of little faith?

Mat 6:31Therefore take no thought, saying, What shall we eat? or, What shall we drink? or, Wherewithal shall we be clothed?

Mat 6:32(For after all these things do the Gentiles seek:) for your heavenly Father knoweth that ye have need of all these things.

Mat 6:33But seek ye first the kingdom of God, and his righteousness; and all these things shall be added unto you.

Mat 6:34Take therefore no thought for the morrow: for the morrow shall take thought for the things of itself. Sufficient unto the day [is] the evil thereof.

[/quote]

This is one of my favourites from my VERY favourite "Sermon On The Mount". I think you applied it appropriately to LDS Missionaries, as well it can be applied to other "Missionaries" of differing stripes, and in varying circumstances.

Unfortunately, few of us adopt it, or consider that it was/is intended to apply to all Humanoids. In this Jesus attempted to illustrate that WE share life essentials with ALL of "God's" Creatures/Creation. As he listed: "...fowls of the air...grass of the fields..."

However, our misguided 'models' (who we most tend to emulate, then and now) were motivated by narcisistic tendencies to embelish themselves with wealth-&-power, as Jesus points out using Solomon as THE supreme example, not of wisdom, but, of greed and stupidity! YIKES!!

How could that be? He was a man of "God"!! No, i suggest, he was THE man of their Establishment, and as such was adulated beyond reason. As we have in our own human midst today. Some who are not considered religious. Others who are, by themselves and others. Just the way it is.

Because, generally speaking, religious types preferr to quote Isaiah, Daniel, Paul, and Revelations; LDS also Joseph Smith, and McKonkie rather than Jesus from HIS teachings on the Mount: "...love your enemies...make peace...ya got 2 coats, give one to the guy with none...seek not wealth...don't master, rather serve..."

Our Western world, being religiously "Christian" based, not Jesus based, can be held to a VERY large degree responsible for the social, political and economic chaos, injustice and 'evils' that most folks generally abhore. YIKES!! How could that be??

Because, generally speaking, 'we' are more inclined to believe than to think. Consequently 'we' demonstrate our 'faith' by belief in the legends, and myths that sufficate the the essense of "Jesus' Social Gospel". His real reason-for-being. Not to get anyone into Heaven. That's an individual's reponsibility, IF....

We have just enjoyed the biggest Pharisaic Demo-party, of this corruption in the last 12 months. FUN-FUN!! With another planned for Dec 25, '08! YIKES:-)

Don't get me wrong. I'm all for the family stuff, and happy times. But to be deluded into thinking THAT pays tribute to Jesus is one of the biggest scams ever created by marketing genius, and Ecclesiastics. It is THE "Ponzie" of the century, ROTFL!!!

At the same time we have another profiteer selling signs advocating "Put Christ Back INTO Christmas"! YIKES!! Entepreneurs, ya gotta admire their, "Cunning and Craftiness", also warned of by Jesus :-)

As Charity noted, this thread has spun along way from my original question, but it has provided learning and opportunities for all to expound. Warm regards, Roger

[_Jason Bourne]

Jason,

I'd like you to read my post to Misery above this post and tell me if your thoughts differ from what I've presented. I don't attempt to speak for LDS but as an LDS observer.

Jersey Girl

I think you are right on point.

[_Dr. Shades]

We have just enjoyed the biggest Pharisaic Demo-party, of this corruption in the last 12 months. FUN-FUN!! With another planned for Dec 25, '08! YIKES:-)

You don't have to celebrate Christmas if you don't want to, Roger.

[_guy sajer]

If we can get back to the topic: Today, my grandson on a mission called us. He said that in the "white book" they can only call parents. But he had asked his misison president if he could call us, too, since he had lived with us the 5 years preceeding his mission. The mission president, who had been raised by grandparents, gave him permission.

Oh,yes, he says he has put on a little weight and is being fed very well by members. Not going hungry at all.

How nice of the mission to let this young VOLUNTEER serving at his OWN EXPENSE call his grandmother on the biggest holiday of the year. The mercy and compassion of the Mormon Church knows no limits.

I wonder if there's another non-cult-like voluntary organization out there that has similar rules?

For what's its worth, I gained about 20 pounds during my two year sentence. We had lots of members who owned Mexican restaurants. $110 does seem like a pretty small amount if you happen to serve in an area where the members don't step up to the food plate.

[_guy sajer]

No I was never a missionary so I would not know, but reading these posts tells me enough that it would suck.
Of course you liked your mission but there have been many others that have not.

Now I have read that the church has cut their monthly money for food down to 110.00 a month. How can anyone live on 110.00 dollars a month for food? They must be hungry all the time. Doesn't the parents pay close to 400.00 a month to the church for the missionary? So where does the rest of the money go?

The church is so rich I would think they could support the missionaries themselves and have them living in lap of luxury because the missionaries are the salesmen for the church and should be paid accordingly. Instead they are living in run down places and forced to live on 110.00 for food. Something does not add up here.

Did the disciples of Christ live in the "lap of luxury"? For that matter, did Christ?

Did my grandparents have a computer?

Did my great grandparents get a ride to school in the morning?

The disciples also wiped their backsides with moss or something the like.

And how precisely is this relevant?

They lived in a different time and place when the vast majority of the population had limited means, had access to few luxuries, worked far in excess of 40 hours a week mostly doing manual labor, had limited leisure time, etc.

So to be authentic "servants" of God today, the Mormon Missionaries must live like Christ's disciples did 2000 years ago?

Give me a friggn' break.

[_Dr. Shades]

Oh,yes, he says he has put on a little weight and is being fed very well by members. Not going hungry at all.

He must be serving in the U.S.A. Missionaries in other countries aren't nearly as lucky. There isn't always a member base that's willing (or able) to feed missionaries.

I served in Japan and would commonly go weeks without a dinner appointment. I lost about 10~15 pounds on my mission.

Besides, it's not the members' responsibility to feed missionaries anyway. It's the church's responsibility to ensure that its volunteers are able to adequately feed themselves sans outside help--a responsibility it's apparently willing to shirk even more than before.

Also, the church typically houses its missionaries in the cheapest places available. Japan was bad enough--no insulation, air conditioning, or central heating--but I can't begin to imagine what it must be like for missionaries in South America whose apartments have dirt floors and no running water.

Combined with the way that missionaries are all but denied access to adequate medical and dental care, the way the multi-billion dollar tax exempt corporate church empire treats its missionaries--especially when it has billions of dollars lying around to build a mall--is nothing short of deplorable.

[_MishMagnet]

It seems the missionaries that are stateside usually gain weight while those in S America lose weight. Of course that's a generalization based on my experience with the missionaries I've known. My missionary lost 70 pounds in Argentina and went several stints just eating potatoes. That was back in the early 90's, though, and has nada to do with the recent decrease in funds.

I would pick up the mishies tab if I saw them out just because I'm concerned about them getting enough to eat and as a kind gesture from one mother to another. (the mishies mothers of course.)