The Handcarts Again..

[_harmony]

There is a simple solution to the OP's dilemma: exercise your God-given right as the father of the family to allow your teenagers the option to stay home. Or conveniently plan a lovely vacation to (fill in the blank) at the same time as the trek.

My kids went on a trek one summer. I'd never allow them to do it again. My girls came home terribly dehydrated.

[_Jason Bourne]

by the way, yes there were elders that told the last two parties to go out and that divine intervention would assure their safe arrival.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mormon_han ... _companies

Prior to the Willie Company departing Florence, the company met to debate the wisdom of such a late departure. Because the emigrants were unfamiliar with the trail and the climate, they deferred to the returning missionaries and Church agents. One of the returning missionaries, Levi Savage, urged them to spend the winter in Nebraska. He argued that such a late departure with a company consisting of the elderly, women and young children would lead to suffering, sickness and even death. All of the other Church elders argued that the trip should go forward, expressing optimism that the company would be protected by divine intervention. Some members of the company, perhaps as many as 100, decided to spend the winter in Florence or in Iowa, but the majority, about 404 in number (including Savage) continued the journey west.

[/quote]

Who were the other Elders. Since all males in good standing are Elders it is a broad description.

[_wenglund]

I go back to my earlier statement... what kind of God requires children be sacrificed to bring forth the one true church?~dancer~

From what I recall of Church history, by and large, the sufferring that the early saints were caused to endure, was at the hand of mankind (specifically enemies of the faith), not God.

Have you ever heard the phrase:"bad things happen to good people"?

Thanks, -Wade Englund-

[_Trinity]

If these handcart treks are such an all-fire, faith-promoting experience, why do they limit it only to the youth? Why do they not extend this opportunity to all members, from infants to old geezers?

[_Jason Bourne]

Jason, and other LDS as appropriate, I am often startled when I write on subjects that come up on this board and I feel as though I have to defend myself from the label of an anti-LDS. I am not attacking the Church when I talk about these emigrants or their children. People do foolish things all the time. I place no blame on the Church, or on LDS -- except for those that were foolish. If this was a board about Japan (and I LOVE Japan) I'd be upset about Nanking. So, when I type something and then have to justify it (because if it was ANY other topic outside of LDS it'd be a-okay) as not being an attack on the Church it gets a little old.

I am NOT attacking the Church. I do however question parents and their ability to care for their children. These were individuals and I make comments on their actions. This is not attacking your faith, or your God, or your Church -- it is attacking their actions and if certain beliefs played into their faulty actions then I can comment on those as well.

I get so tired of people responding to me as if I'm attacking them. I don't think I am?

I do not recall saying you were anti or attacking anyone. Just discussing....

[_wenglund]

If these handcart treks are such an all-fire, faith-promoting experience, why do they limit it only to the youth? Why do they not extend this opportunity to all members, from infants to old geezers?

Why are you jumping to all these false conclusions?

Thanks, -Wade Englund-

[_Jason Bourne]

If these handcart treks are such an all-fire, faith-promoting experience, why do they limit it only to the youth? Why do they not extend this opportunity to all members, from infants to old geezers?

Old geezers can go.

[_wenglund]

I had an acquaintence in high school whose wealthy parents required, among other highly protective things, that he be taken to school and back in a taxi cab. The reasoning (which came mostly from his mother), was that she didn't want her little boy to risk getting germs or getting hurt by the rough-and-tumble of bus rides or suffer harm in any way by walking round-trip to school.

As would be expected, my acquaintene was very timid and shy--to the point that I, and even some of the otherwise aggressive males in our class, refrained from the typical verbal or physical joisting for fear that my acquaintence would be crushed, and were even somewhat protective of him with those inclined to rib him about being a so-called "sissy" or a "momma's boy".

Looking back, I think we may all have done my acquaintence a disservice in being somewhat overly protective, and not better preparing him to face the harsh realities of life--that is, were he to have ever gotten out on his own.

But, that may just be me.

I think it important to strike a healthy balance between the oft unavoidable risk/reward relationship. To me, part of the wisdom in having both a mother and a father is to help the children strike a healthy balance (mothers will typically error on the side of caution, and fathers will typically error on the side of rewards).

Thanks, -Wade Englund-

[_Sethbag]

l.

ps: for what it's worth, that now well-used story of the guy who stood up in Cedar City during a meeting where someone criticized the handcart company ordeal, and told about how he'd been there, and when he thought he couldn't go on anymore and the handcart would start pushing him instead, that was my great great grandfather, Francis Webster.

Cool

You are famous!! what do you think of what he said?

I think he was given a lemon, and made from it lemonade.

[_capt jack]

Who were the other Elders. Since all males in good standing are Elders it is a broad description.

The most prominent Elder was Franklin D Richards. Richards, after rebuking Levi Savage, said the following:

Richards gave us plenty of counsel to be faithful, prayerful, obedient to our leaders, etc., and wound up by prophesying in the name of Israel’s God that ‘though it might storm on our right hand and on our left, the Lord would keep open the way before us and we should get to Zion in safety.’ (The Gathering of Zion, page 243)

Franklin Richards bio can be found here; as it states, he was a member of the Quorum of the 12 at the time he made the prophecy to the unfortunate handcart emigrants.