I don't think anyone here has said that all forms of criticism is always good, no matter what.
I and others of the "pro-criticism crowd" have said there are good ways and bad ways to criticize. All forms of criticism have their place DEPENDING ON THE SITUATION.
I think the premise of Oakes, "You should not criticize the leaders of the church, even if it has merrit" (whatever the actually quote is, I don't have it front of me), is to squelch dissent and to make one Morg collective.
Deserved and vocal criticism of those in leadership positions is the best way to keep them in check and not allow them to abuse their power. It is also the American way. Check out what Teddy Roosevelt said about being critical of the US President during war.
Last edited by Guest on Fri Jan 11, 2008 2:39 am, edited 1 time in total.
Knowledge is Power
Power Corrupts
Study Hard and
Become EVIL!
Doctor Steuss wrote:“Be the change that you want to see in the world.” --Mohandas Gandhi
“Have you had a good bowel movement this morning, sisters?” -Mohandas Gandhi
:-)
C'mon. Time and place, dude.
There's always time and it's always the place for a quick laugh.
Boy, if only you had a good smilie, THEN it would have been hilarious. Shame, that....
You know if we all stopped using punctuation and misspelled every other word I bet Shades would capitulate.
"Surely he knows that DCP, The Nehor, Lamanite, and other key apologists..." -Scratch clarifying my status in apologetics "I admit it; I'm a petty, petty man." -Some Schmo
skippy the dead wrote:You're assuming it involved a laugh.
I'm always funny. Anyone who thinks I'm not should be stuck in Guantanamo, tried as an enemy combatant, and publicly stoned.
"Surely he knows that DCP, The Nehor, Lamanite, and other key apologists..." -Scratch clarifying my status in apologetics "I admit it; I'm a petty, petty man." -Some Schmo
skippy the dead wrote:You're assuming it involved a laugh.
I'm always funny. Anyone who thinks I'm not should be stuck in Guantanamo, tried as an enemy combatant, and publicly stoned.
Would it be a criticism to inform you that you are not always funny? If so, according to charity, I shouldn't tell you. But if it's feedback, I should. What the hell - you're not always funny.
(I had to get this back on topic somehow).
I may be going to hell in a bucket, babe / But at least I'm enjoying the ride.
-Grateful Dead (lyrics by John Perry Barlow)
skippy the dead wrote:You're assuming it involved a laugh.
I'm always funny. Anyone who thinks I'm not should be stuck in Guantanamo, tried as an enemy combatant, and publicly stoned.
Would it be a criticism to inform you that you are not always funny? If so, according to charity, I shouldn't tell you. But if it's feedback, I should. What the hell - you're not always funny.
(I had to get this back on topic somehow).
I'll take it as constructive feedback and shoot the guy who writes my zingers. Thank you for that feedback.
"Surely he knows that DCP, The Nehor, Lamanite, and other key apologists..." -Scratch clarifying my status in apologetics "I admit it; I'm a petty, petty man." -Some Schmo
skippy the dead wrote:You're assuming it involved a laugh.
I'm always funny. Anyone who thinks I'm not should be stuck in Guantanamo, tried as an enemy combatant, and publicly stoned.
Would it be a criticism to inform you that you are not always funny? If so, according to charity, I shouldn't tell you. But if it's feedback, I should. What the hell - you're not always funny.
(I had to get this back on topic somehow).
I'll take it as constructive feedback and shoot the guy who writes my zingers. Thank you for that feedback.
Sorry - I shouldn't post when I've got the crankies. My apologies if I offend.
As you were.
I may be going to hell in a bucket, babe / But at least I'm enjoying the ride.
-Grateful Dead (lyrics by John Perry Barlow)
skippy the dead wrote:You're assuming it involved a laugh.
I'm always funny. Anyone who thinks I'm not should be stuck in Guantanamo, tried as an enemy combatant, and publicly stoned.
Would it be a criticism to inform you that you are not always funny? If so, according to charity, I shouldn't tell you. But if it's feedback, I should. What the hell - you're not always funny.
(I had to get this back on topic somehow).
I'll take it as constructive feedback and shoot the guy who writes my zingers. Thank you for that feedback.
Sorry - I shouldn't post when I've got the crankies. My apologies if I offend.
As you were.
I'm not offended. Part of playing the fool/class clown is accepting that some days the genius will not flow........how many days it doesn't....not sure I want to know.
"Surely he knows that DCP, The Nehor, Lamanite, and other key apologists..." -Scratch clarifying my status in apologetics "I admit it; I'm a petty, petty man." -Some Schmo
We are not "told" anything. There is no guy in the sky telling us what we can an can't do.
Judgment is good, exercise it. Criticism is good if the intent behind it is good. Charity knows this, but she wants to defend an indefensible position, so she will forego reason for the sake of playing her "you can't prove anything" game, while no one is attempting to "prove" anything.
In a competitive world, all ideas should be challenged so that we can have better ideas and thereby, better lives. Those who believe that the best ideas have already been laid out by "god" are wrong--Charity included.
The leaders of the LDS Church are deceivers of the worst kind. They are the wolves in sheep's clothing who preach, "Beware of the wolves in sheep's clothing." What is more dangerous than that? Charity is both deceived and a deceiver in the same deception and I believe on some level she knows it. She simply enjoys her game. I'm sorry, but if there is such a thing as evil, that is it.
Charity argues from a completely unfalsifiable position which is immune to reason. So discussing anything with her will inevitably go in eternal circles.
She hypocritically demands rational evidence when her entire position is ultimately founded on that which is not amenable to rational evidence.
She and her church are in great need of critical analysis and even ridicule. Just as it excites Charity to think of all the people whom, she believes, will get their well deserved "I told you sos" on the "other side," I too wish to see some justice when it comes to the lame claims of the apologists and their insincere ilk, including Charity. There is just too much human suffering around the issue of religion and especially the LDS religion to not want to have the situation change for the better. That is why I criticize Charity and her evil organization.
I am sorry when I see such attitudes as this expressed.
Isaiah 5: 20-21 ¶ Woe unto them that call evil good, and good evil; that put darkness for light, and light for darkness; that put bitter for sweet, and sweet for bitter! Woe unto them that are wise in their own eyes, and prudent in their own sight!
We are not "told" anything. There is no guy in the sky telling us what we can an can't do.
Judgment is good, exercise it. Criticism is good if the intent behind it is good. Charity knows this, but she wants to defend an indefensible position, so she will forego reason for the sake of playing her "you can't prove anything" game, while no one is attempting to "prove" anything.
In a competitive world, all ideas should be challenged so that we can have better ideas and thereby, better lives. Those who believe that the best ideas have already been laid out by "god" are wrong--Charity included.
The leaders of the LDS Church are deceivers of the worst kind. They are the wolves in sheep's clothing who preach, "Beware of the wolves in sheep's clothing." What is more dangerous than that? Charity is both deceived and a deceiver in the same deception and I believe on some level she knows it. She simply enjoys her game. I'm sorry, but if there is such a thing as evil, that is it.
Charity argues from a completely unfalsifiable position which is immune to reason. So discussing anything with her will inevitably go in eternal circles.
She hypocritically demands rational evidence when her entire position is ultimately founded on that which is not amenable to rational evidence.
She and her church are in great need of critical analysis and even ridicule. Just as it excites Charity to think of all the people whom, she believes, will get their well deserved "I told you sos" on the "other side," I too wish to see some justice when it comes to the lame claims of the apologists and their insincere ilk, including Charity. There is just too much human suffering around the issue of religion and especially the LDS religion to not want to have the situation change for the better. That is why I criticize Charity and her evil organization.
I am sorry when I see such attitudes as this expressed.
Isaiah 5: 20-21 ¶ Woe unto them that call evil good, and good evil; that put darkness for light, and light for darkness; that put bitter for sweet, and sweet for bitter! Woe unto them that are wise in their own eyes, and prudent in their own sight!
Well take a look in the mirror because this applies to you even though you refuse to see it--at least publicly. You will never wake up from your self-imposed sleep so I see no reason to dance around the issue with you. Your views and attitudes need to be criticized and ridiculed.
You say that you lose nothing by choosing "The Gospel of Jesus Christ" in this life. I say that you simply lack imagination. Even though you will die contented with your delusion, I think you will have lost out on the possibilities available to those who perceive the value in following their own ideas and not those of a long deceased con artist or an imaginary deity. I know, I know--you KNOW that God has assured you with a real witness. Sadly you are mistaken and I mourn the loss of your true potential.