Firsthand Accounts of the Second Anointing

[_The Nehor]

I deny that the Holy Ghost exists!

There, now you've (virtually) met another. :P

I don't doubt your sincerity but to commit the sin....not sure if you've met the prereqs. Good luck in your quest.

[_The Nehor]

God is the only one who matters. No one in the Church has the power to condemn someone to Outer Darkness and our own scriptures limit our punishment to excommunication. I don't know if I've ever met anyone who has denied the HG. There are two that I suspect it of but no more than suspect.

But don't you think the Holy Ghost is God?

Yes, he is a part of the God in one sense, a God in another sense, and is God in most senses.

[_skippy the dead]

I had seen that posting. It raises some interesting questions to me (as with Truth Dancer, I'd never heard of such a rite until after I stopped associating with the church). First, it seems counter to the concept of final judgment to have someone guaranteed their salvation prior to the completion of his or her life. What would be the basis for such a declaration?

In addition, the extra layer of secrecy is somewhat of a concern to me. Although we may be counseled to not discuss the content of the endowment ceremony, we do not have to hide the fact that we are going to the temple to receive it. Why would the church put such a cloak of secrecy around the rite, if it is something that would be considered to be a great honor?

And although Nehor pretends to have had God explain to him what some of the blessings mean (and boy is that shtick getting tiresome), I wonder what the practical meanings of them would be? Especially this "getting to live as long as you want" thing. That is astonishing. And somehow strikes me as wrong.

Essentially, if this account is accurate, there is definitely a secret caste system in place in the church, which would seem to run counter to the basic principles taught by Jesus.

So does anybody here have any good information on this rite?

I'm sorry that my having revelation in order to be exalted is tired shtick for you. Still, seems a small price for me to pay.

I recommend the book Mysteries of Godliness if you want to know more.

Nehor, don't you believe everyone has access to revelation?

Yes, but unless Skippy is being amazingly subtle I think she thinks I pretend to get more than most.

No, I wasn't being subtle. Although it may not be "pretending" - I wouldn't be surprised if you actually think that you and God converse regularly. For all I know, you may also have a leprechaun in your medicine cabinet and a winged-pony in your backyard.

I suppose the thing that irks my squid is the fact that you parade your supposed conversations with God about so freely with an undertone of "God told me something you don't know - neener-neener-neener" superiority. Honestly, it gives off a whiff of mental instability. And so long as that's your standard mode of operation, odds are I'll be unable to refrain from commenting on it occasionally.

[_Scottie]

No one in the Church has the power to condemn someone to Outer Darkness and our own scriptures limit our punishment to excommunication.

Ahh, but thanks to the CaEMS, we now have a host of members who have the power to curse. So, punishment is NOT limited to excommunication.

[_The Nehor]

No, I wasn't being subtle. Although it may not be "pretending" - I wouldn't be surprised if you actually think that you and God converse regularly. For all I know, you may also have a leprechaun in your medicine cabinet and a winged-pony in your backyard.

I suppose the thing that irks my squid is the fact that you parade your supposed conversations with God about so freely with an undertone of "God told me something you don't know - neener-neener-neener" superiority. Honestly, it gives off a whiff of mental instability. And so long as that's your standard mode of operation, odds are I'll be unable to refrain from commenting on it occasionally.

Fair enough. I will try to avoid the neenering in future though not sure how to. The problem is on these boards people are always asking questions that I think can only be answered by revelation. Then they get annoyed when I say that's where I got it. Not sure what else to do though so I'll just continue as is.

You are not the first to say that I seem mentally unstable. People who know me say I'm a very stable kind of insane. Not sure how to take that.

The leprechaun in my medicine cabinet says hi and I can't have a winged pony. I live in an apartment. :(

[_the road to hana]

God is the only one who matters. No one in the Church has the power to condemn someone to Outer Darkness and our own scriptures limit our punishment to excommunication. I don't know if I've ever met anyone who has denied the HG. There are two that I suspect it of but no more than suspect.

But don't you think the Holy Ghost is God?

Yes, he is a part of the God in one sense, a God in another sense, and is God in most senses.

So, if the LDS Church is not true, and the HG thinks LDS temple ritual ridicules the atonement, isn't participating in it itself a sense of denying the Holy Ghost?

[_Scottie]

Essentially, if this account is accurate, there is definitely a secret caste system in place in the church, which would seem to run counter to the basic principles taught by Jesus.

This is what concerns me as well. It goes against the Beatitudes taught be Jesus, himself:
Blessed are the meek: for they shall inherit the earth.
Matthew 5:5

Something about "the last shall be first" seems appropriate here, as well as the suggestion that it is more difficult for a rich person to enter the kingdom of heaven.

Or how about Luke 14:11-15?

The way it's currently set up, it seems more to be like being knighted, or having an honorary title bestowed, in recognition for services rendered (including generosity), and sets up a secret society within a secret society. From a New Testament point of view, it would seem to make far more sense if this blessing were given to the least of these, the poor, the meek, the humble, and the oppressed.

I'm not sure I follow you here.

From the OP, it seemed like this guy was very meek and humble. It doesn't say anything about his financial status. After his initial meeting, he pondered whether he was worthy of such a blessing. When asked to name potential future recipients, he had a struggle to make sure the names he submitted were worthy.

[_the road to hana]

The problem is on these boards people are always asking questions that I think can only be answered by revelation. Then they get annoyed when I say that's where I got it.

Revelation from whom? A prophet for the benefit of the whole? Or a single individual who is only supposed to have revelation for the benefit of himself/herself?

It's doubtful even from an LDS point of view that your "revelation" extends to the general public, on message boards or otherwise.

[_Sethbag]

A couple of things. Assuming the account is true, it seems rather anticlimactic.

lol. Given that the church is just a regular old man made church, what sort of 'climax' would you expect there to be?

Well, for starters, if the church were actually true I would have expected that they would have seen Christ. Whether official or not, I too had always understood that the Calling and Election Made Sure was performed by the Savior himself. For TBMs being annointed and having one's feet washed by an Apostle would be pretty heady stuff, but it's still not Jesus.

This seems like quite a retention booster.

Is there any wonder those little knowing smiles you get from some of the old-timers if topics critical of the church come up? It's like they know something you don't. How could one fail to feel pretty confident and "in the know" when some upstart began speaking about Joseph Smith in critical and negative ways, when one has been annointed an actual King and Priest to God, by an Apostle? When one has been blessed to actually be a God after the resurrection? When one has been guaranteed a spot in the Celestial Kingdom, while still alive?

Very interesting stuff. How can inconvenient facts about Joseph Smith and church history even touch someone who has been told they've made it, and they've already got their ticket to the Celestial Kingdom.

[_The Nehor]

So, if the LDS Church is not true, and the HG thinks LDS temple ritual ridicules the atonement, isn't participating in it itself a sense of denying the Holy Ghost?

Yes, it would be a sin in the eyes of God. Why anyone else would care is beyond me.