90% of Provo rapes not reported to police

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_The Nehor
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Post by _The Nehor »

Scottie wrote:
Dr. Shades wrote:
More than 90 percent of rapes in the city go unreported, according to the lead rape investigator for the BYU Police Department


I call B.S. If they go unreported, then how is it possible to count how many there are?


My guess is they pulled statistics from national averages and got a # of rapes per x thousand people, then applied that number to the population of Utah County.


Which is voodoo statistics.

I'm with Pirate too. Rape victims almost always develop a degree of self-loathing no matter what their religious training.
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_Trinity
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Post by _Trinity »

Why have they chosen to pull up this old article? How very odd.

When I worked for BYU police department in the late 80's, there was not a single reported incident of either forcible or nonforcible rape. I located the report for the timeframe of this article and noticed that things have not changed much.

http://ope.ed.gov/security/InstDetail.asp

Edited: The link wouldn't work to specific offenses for some reason. You'll need to scroll to the bottom for criminal, hate, arrest detail.
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_Scottie
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Post by _Scottie »

Interesting comment...

Rapes (especially date rape) are not reported in Utah because everybody is so judgmental and blames the victim! I was raped. But victims of rape in Utah are accused of wearing immodest clothing, or not following the spirit and going places they should not be, or not listening to the still small voice tell them when a guy is a bad guy, etc. I was horrified by how I was treated after the attack.
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_moksha
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Post by _moksha »

Trinity wrote:Why have they chosen to pull up this old article? How very odd.

When I worked for BYU police department in the late 80's, there was not a single reported incident of either forcible or nonforcible rape. I located the report for the timeframe of this article and noticed that things have not changed much.

http://ope.ed.gov/security/InstDetail.asp

Edited: The link wouldn't work to specific offenses for some reason. You'll need to scroll to the bottom for criminal, hate, arrest detail.


Apparently no such offenses are committed on or off campus involving BYU in 2004-2006. I noticed they did happen at the University of Utah though. Must have been by those gentiles and the gentile girls who would report such a crime.
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_Imwashingmypirate
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Re: Definitions

Post by _Imwashingmypirate »

JAK wrote:
Imwashingmypirate wrote:I disagree. Woman that are raped are no longer virgins. That is how it is.


It’s all a matter of definition, Pirate.

JAK


Not really. I would imagine that if anyone has experienced sex all the way, they are no longer virgin, whether they chose that or not. It would be nice for them to think they are still virgin but then that is just denial.
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_beastie
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Post by _beastie »

Usually the number of unreported rapes are determined through surveys.

Yes, all victims of rape suffer from after-effects that can include self loathing and self-blame. The question here is whether the larger culture supports and exaggerates such negative effects or attempts to ameliorate the situation. If the larger culture actually supports and exaggerates these negative effects, victims of rape are far less likely to report the rape. While we may have questions about how the information was obtained, clearly rapes are under-reported in Provo by a significant amount, more than is seen in the larger culture.

Several decades ago, when rape victims knew the larger culture would view them as "damaged", and knew that their own sex lives and other personal aspects of their behavior would be inspected under a microscope, they were far less inclined to report the rape. Although the situation is not perfect, this affect has diminished over the past several decades due to a deliberate, concerted effort.

Apparently, once again, LDS culture lags behind the larger culture when it comes to progressive movement in this regard.

But, you know, even when our larger culture supported and exaggerated the self loathing of rape victims by being determined to show they "asked for it", I don't recall our culture teaching females that, once threatened with rape, it would be better to die fighting then "let" it happen. In other words - better dead than raped. Does anyone else recall our larger culture supporting such an idea?
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_antishock8
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Post by _antishock8 »

I don't think this is bs, even though it truly is hard to report unreported crimes, no? For example, I once read (and I know I'm being anecdotal) that male victims of rape are significantly less likely to report it than female victims of rape because of the associated cultural stigmas. Frankly, I would have a hard time, too. Why? Because of where I work. Because of how they would view me. Because of my children, and how they might interpret the whole affair. If I had to take the stand and testify more people would know about it. I run the risk of the media broadcasting to the world the incident. For me, the whole experience would akin to a second assault... Perhaps even worse.

All this being said, it's very understandable why a woman won't report a rape. The feeling that you're damaged goods. That others view you awkwardly. They'll always know what happened to you. Some will question why it happened, or if it was really rape. It's a terribly humiliating ordeal these people have to suffer. I'm not surprised by the guesstimate at all. My sympathies go out to them...
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_Trinity
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Post by _Trinity »

beastie wrote:Usually the number of unreported rapes are determined through surveys.

Yes, all victims of rape suffer from after-effects that can include self loathing and self-blame. The question here is whether the larger culture supports and exaggerates such negative effects or attempts to ameliorate the situation. If the larger culture actually supports and exaggerates these negative effects, victims of rape are far less likely to report the rape. While we may have questions about how the information was obtained, clearly rapes are under-reported in Provo by a significant amount, more than is seen in the larger culture.

Several decades ago, when rape victims knew the larger culture would view them as "damaged", and knew that their own sex lives and other personal aspects of their behavior would be inspected under a microscope, they were far less inclined to report the rape. Although the situation is not perfect, this affect has diminished over the past several decades due to a deliberate, concerted effort.

Apparently, once again, LDS culture lags behind the larger culture when it comes to progressive movement in this regard.

But, you know, even when our larger culture supported and exaggerated the self loathing of rape victims by being determined to show they "asked for it", I don't recall our culture teaching females that, once threatened with rape, it would be better to die fighting then "let" it happen. In other words - better dead than raped. Does anyone else recall our larger culture supporting such an idea?


Well, there are certainly enough cultural anecdotes that would support this.

"From the beginning of time, the Lord has set a clear and unmistakable standard of sexual purity. It always has been, it is now, and it always will be the same. That standard is the law of chastity. It is the same for all—for men and women, for old and young, for rich and poor. In the Book of Mormon, the prophet Jacob tells us that the Lord delights in the chastity of His children (see Jacob 2:28). Do you hear that, my brothers and sisters? The Lord is not just pleased when we are chaste; He delights in chastity. Mormon taught the same thing to his son Moroni when he wrote that chastity and virtue are “most dear and precious above all things” (Moroni 9:9)." President Ezra Taft Benson, BYU Devotional, October 13, 1987, New Era, Jan. 1988, page 4


"Better dead clean, than alive unclean. Many is the faithful Latter-day Saint parent who has sent a son or daughter on a mission or otherwise out into the world with the direction, 'I would rather have you come back home in a pine box with your virtue than return alive without it' "
Apostle Bruce R. McConkie, Mormon Doctrine (all editions), page 124.


" Your virtue is worth more than your life. Please young folk, preserve your virtue even if you lose your lives. Do not tamper with sin . . . do not permit yourselves to be led into temptation. Conduct yourselves seemly and with due regard, particularly your young boys, to the sanctity of womanhood. Do not pollute it." President Spencer W. Kimball, The Miracle of Forgiveness, pg 63.


“The victim must do all in his or her power to stop the abuse. Most often, the victim is innocent because of being disabled by fear or the power or authority of the offender. At some point in time, however, the Lord may prompt a victim to recognize a degree of responsibility for abuse. Your priesthood leader will help assess your responsibility so that, if needed, it can be addressed. Otherwise the seeds of guilt will remain and sprout into bitter fruit. Yet no matter what degree of responsibility, from absolutely none to increasing consent, the healing power of the atonement of Jesus Christ can provide a complete cure.”
- Apostle Richard G. Scott “Healing the Tragic Scars of Abuse,” General Conference, Ensign, May 1992


“Of course, a mature person who willingly consents to sexual relations must share responsibility for the act, even though the other participant was the aggressor. Persons who consciously invite sexual advances also have a share of responsibility for the behavior that follows. But persons who are truly forced into sexual relations are victims and are not guilty of any sexual sin.”
- First Presidency Letter to General Authorities, Regional Representatives, and other priesthood leadership, 7 Feb. 1985


"You will recall Alma’s teaching his son Corianton that unchastity is the most serious offense there is in the sight of God, except for murder or denying the Holy Ghost. (See Alma 39:5.) President Clark, in a conference address in October 1938, said: 'Chastity is fundamental to our life and to our civilization. If the race becomes unchaste, it will perish. Immorality has been basic to the destruction of mighty nations of the past; it will bring to dust the mighty nations of the present. You young people, may I directly entreat you to be chaste. Please believe me when I say that chastity is worth more than life itself. This is the doctrine my parents taught me; it is truth. It is better to die chaste than to live unchaste. The salvation of your very souls is concerned in this.' Now, my dear friends, we know there is nothing new in what we have said. These things are time-tested; they are true. To this we testify."
-LDS First Presidency Message "We Believe in Being Chaste," Ensign, Sept. 1981, 3


Within the enduring covenant of marriage, the Lord permits husband and wife the expression of the sacred procreative powers in all their loveliness and beauty within the bounds He has set. One purpose of this private, sacred, intimate experience is to provide the physical bodies for the spirits Father in Heaven wants to experience mortality. Another reason for these powerful and beautiful feelings of love is to bind husband and wife together in loyalty, fidelity, consideration of each other, and common purpose.

“However, those intimate acts are forbidden by the Lord outside the enduring commitment of marriage because they undermine His purposes. Within the sacred covenant of marriage, such relationships are according to His plan. When experienced any other way, they are against His will. They cause serious emotional and spiritual harm. Even though participants do not realize that is happening now, they will later. Sexual immorality creates a barrier to the influence of the Holy Spirit with all its uplifting, enlightening, and empowering capabilities. It causes powerful physical and emotional stimulation. In time that creates an unquenchable appetite that drives the offender to ever more serious sin. It engenders selfishness and can produce aggressive acts such as brutality,abortion, sexual abuse, and violent crime. Such stimulation can lead to acts of homosexuality, and they are evil and absolutely wrong.” (Richard Scott, “Making the Right Choices,” Ensign, Nov. 1994, 38).


(I just had to throw that one in there because it left me with a big "huh? Sexual immorality leads to homosexuality and violent crime? Wow.)

One of the most sobering statements about being chaste is that of Alma to his son Corianton: “Know ye not, my son,” he said, “that these things are an abomination in the sight of the Lord; yea, most abominable above all sins save it be the shedding of innocent blood or denying the Holy Ghost?” (Alma 39:5; emphasis added). Very few of us will ever be guilty of murder or of the sin against the Holy Ghost. But the law of chastity is frequently broken and yet it stands next to these other sins in seriousness in the eyes of the Lord. Ezra Taft Benson, “The Law of Chastity,” New Era, Jan 1988, 4


My precious young brothers, may you understand that chastity is the source of virile manhood, the crown of beautiful womanhood, the foundation of a happy home, and the ultimate and perfect standard underlying all spiritual progression. May we who have been called be worthy to be chosen. Robert L. Backman, “Chastity: The Source of True Manhood,” Ensign, Nov 1989, 38
Last edited by cinepro on Fri Feb 01, 2008 5:29 pm, edited 1 time in total.
"I think one of the great mysteries of the gospel is that anyone still believes it." Sethbag, MADB, Feb 22 2008
_truth dancer
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Post by _truth dancer »

My personal experience working with survivors of sexual assault supports the stats. About one in ten report. Fewer prosecute.

The reality is, regardless of religion or culture, women do not want to report rape. The ramifications are just too great. It is a miserable, emotionally painful experience for women to have to discuss, share, admit or relive the experience. When women call a crisis hotline, or show up in a hospital, often the first words out of their mouth are, "No one can know."

In those cultures where there is a high value on virginity, where one's virginity is associated with righteousness, where shame is associated with the loss of virginity the negative consequences of reporting are even greater.

~dancer~


Trinity... thanks for collecting all those quote. Wow! :-)
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_Mercury
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Post by _Mercury »

At some point in time, however, the Lord may prompt a victim to recognize a degree of responsibility for abuse.


This makes me sick and mad.
And crawling on the planet's face
Some insects called the human race
Lost in time
And lost in space...and meaning
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