Helen Whitney on Discussing Mormonism

[_Gazelam]

I don't understand what the two of you are asking.

How exactly should people act when they have problems? What exactly in your opinion should people do with their problems? Make Sacrament meeting more interesting with their confessions?

What is it you want to change?

[_John Larsen]

I don't understand what the two of you are asking.

How exactly should people act when they have problems? What exactly in your opinion should people do with their problems? Make Sacrament meeting more interesting with their confessions?

What is it you want to change?

I think their point is that the Church has a strong interest in keeping its members in an emotional stunted state of dependency.

[_BishopRic]

I don't understand what the two of you are asking.

How exactly should people act when they have problems? What exactly in your opinion should people do with their problems? Make Sacrament meeting more interesting with their confessions?

What is it you want to change?

I think their point is that the Church has a strong interest in keeping its members in an emotional stunted state of dependency.

Yes, there is a particular "look" in Mormonism. It is that everything is "okay," even if it is not. The smiles you see on Sunday...for most of my life, I thought it was because everybody was happy -- because they had the one and only true gospel. After serving as bishop, I learned that Mormons are experts at voluntary schizophrenia...how quick they turn from "everything is great" to "please Bishop, I need your help!"

1.2 seconds...it's the standing record -- does anybody have a winner that beats that?!

[_Gazelam]

John

I think their point is that the Church has a strong interest in keeping its members in an emotional stunted state of dependency.

So they are dependent by not sharing their problems and keeping things hidden?

Better rethink your stance.

[_Gazelam]

Bishop,

Is there something wrong with trials? Is there something wrong with asking for help in the effort to become independent? perfection is made in incremental improvements, not in a a wish granted by a benevolent Genie.

[_BishopRic]

Bishop,

Is there something wrong with trials? Is there something wrong with asking for help in the effort to become independent? perfection is made in incremental improvements, not in a a wish granted by a benevolent Genie.

The point is not the "trials," but the authenticity and projection of the members' situation. It seems that many members feel the need to appear "perfect," even when they are not. To me that is a form of dishonesty.

The overly high incidence of depression in the church is evidence that there is a disconnect between expectations and reality. For whatever reason, Mormons try to do more than they are capable of doing, and there are consequences for that. Perhaps it is the emphasis on "works" for salvation?

So, no, I don't see anything wrong with asking for help -- I think more need to speak up about the problems they have, and should learn to say no to callings when they are already overwhelmed with responsibilities.

[_John Larsen]

John

I think their point is that the Church has a strong interest in keeping its members in an emotional stunted state of dependency.

So they are dependent by not sharing their problems and keeping things hidden?

Better rethink your stance.

Absolutely. Now the authority wants to know stuff, but the Church encourages people to hid in shame. You are taught that you are a worm and that you are forever dependent upon the Church. "If it wasn't for the Church, I don't know where I would be today" is a common refrain. This implies that if people were to drop their dependence on the Church, all of their bad tenancies would take over and they would end up in a ditch somewhere.

[_BishopRic]

John

I think their point is that the Church has a strong interest in keeping its members in an emotional stunted state of dependency.

So they are dependent by not sharing their problems and keeping things hidden?

Better rethink your stance.

Absolutely. Now the authority wants to know stuff, but the Church encourages people to hid in shame. You are taught that you are a worm and that you are forever dependent upon the Church. "If it wasn't for the Church, I don't know where I would be today" is a common refrain. This implies that if people were to drop their dependence on the Church, all of their bad tenancies would take over and they would end up in a ditch somewhere.

And it's funny how they view the results...I know many who look at my "story" and say "look, he left the church and went through a divorce, started drinking alcohol, coffee and tea!" This is all true, but I see my life now as the best it's ever been; but even as I tell them this, they see it as "selfish indulgence."

Can't win for losing!