Upward mobility in Mormonism?

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_moksha
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Post by _moksha »

I noticed that in every stake that I have lived in, the SP came from the highest socio-economic class available in that stake.


While not really the best and the brightest, this description does seem to ring true. It also seems to have an unfortunate quality as well.


Lest I wax to holy, I am fairly certain that I am among the untouchable Mormon class. At least that helps explain the deep sh** in my life.
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_Moniker
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Post by _Moniker »

moksha wrote:

Lest I wax to holy, I am fairly certain that I am among the untouchable Mormon class. At least that helps explain the deep sh** in my life.


Are you being serious?
_moksha
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Post by _moksha »

Moniker wrote:
moksha wrote:Lest I wax to holy, I am fairly certain that I am among the untouchable Mormon class.


Are you being serious?


Somewhat serious. I have little or no contact with the ward members except on Sunday. I am divorced and so I am not in on any social activities. The people I know best are the non-mormons in my ward.
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_Moniker
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Post by _Moniker »

moksha wrote:
Moniker wrote:
moksha wrote:Lest I wax to holy, I am fairly certain that I am among the untouchable Mormon class.


Are you being serious?


Somewhat serious. I have little or no contact with the ward members except on Sunday. I am divorced and so I am not in on any social activities. The people I know best are the non-mormons in my ward.


Sorry about that, Moksha. I'm glad to know you. You usually bring a smile to my face.
_Scottie
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Post by _Scottie »

I'm not sure if this is relevant, but I know that in Utah County, being a "good Mormon" will get you further in business than being a non-Mormon or an inactive Mormon.

For some reason, other Mormons believe you will be more trustworthy if you are a good Mormon.

Also, I think it is just human nature to group with those that share a similar lifestyle. I don't judge those that are less or more fortunate than myself, but as a general rule, I don't enjoy hanging out with them. I prefer to hang out with people that are in more in my class.
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_Moniker
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Post by _Moniker »

Scottie wrote:
Also, I think it is just human nature to group with those that share a similar lifestyle. I don't judge those that are less or more fortunate than myself, but as a general rule, I don't enjoy hanging out with them. I prefer to hang out with people that are in more in my class.


I must be one odd duck. I enjoy stepping out of my "class" and interacting with others. That's why I made a decision to move to my community and work in a poverty stricken school with those at the bottom of the socio-economic ladder. I love that it's a mixed neighborhood socio-economically as well as in heritage.

It very well may be human nature to cling to those that are similar -- yet, I think that does a disservice to ourselves. We can learn so much by attempting to relate to those that are outside our norms. Reminds us that humanity does not end at these class, language, educational, and cultural barriers.
_JAK
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Upward mobility in Any Organization of Size

Post by _JAK »

Mercury wrote:It is my observation that those in certain social classes within Mormonism stay in the social class they were born into. Not only that they stay in said social class but there is, in the lower and middle class Mormon mindset a "peasant" attitude of reverence for the upper classes, reinforced by said upper classes being predominate in leadership roles.

It seemed as if being well-to-do was a qualification for a perceived higher spirituality and interaction between the classes was discouraged. Case in point, I and a handfull of colleagues were starting a business. We needed a lawyer to draw up papers for incorporation. When I inquired with my grandparents for the contact information for someone in their old ward who was in that field by name, I was told that that is not how this is done and to find someone else more "on our level". Several other incidents like this were experienced by myself throughout my life.

Does/did anyone else see this attitude?


Mercury,

Your “observation” can be applied much more universally to religious organizations. The larger they are, the greater the divisions within the group. “Prominent leadership roles” are coveted in any larger group organization. There is competition for those roles. So even at “the top” there is competition.

It appears that those who have thus far given you an unqualified “no” to your question are unable or unwilling to articulate their thinking. “Level” is almost always important. I can think of no organization of any size in which “level” of individuals is not considered and given conscious or unconscious regard.

Where a hierarchy exists, there are “levels” in that hierarchy. Someone is at the top. Meetings are held. Certain people are “invited” to the meetings and others are not invited.

The only aspect of your observation which I would challenge you to consider is that the principle which you observe is far wider than Mormonism. It’s much more universal.

My agreement is with your observation. I suspect in a longer post, you could further detail and evidence to support your observation.

Those who merely say “no” to your affirmative observation fail to offer any refutation. While your examples were limited, I feel confident you could offer additional ones.

JAK
_Scottie
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Post by _Scottie »

At my job, we have a large number of migrant workers in the manufacturing plant. These workers are never even considered when hiring for a new job "up front", even though many of them would be more qualified than a new employee coming in.
If there's one thing I've learned from this board, it's that consensual sex with multiple partners is okay unless God commands it. - Abman

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_Mercury
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Post by _Mercury »

Scottie wrote:I'm not sure if this is relevant, but I know that in Utah County, being a "good Mormon" will get you further in business than being a non-Mormon or an inactive Mormon.

For some reason, other Mormons believe you will be more trustworthy if you are a good Mormon.

Also, I think it is just human nature to group with those that share a similar lifestyle. I don't judge those that are less or more fortunate than myself, but as a general rule, I don't enjoy hanging out with them. I prefer to hang out with people that are in more in my class.


As Mr Clean Face in Nevada can tell you, Mormons are as corrupt as the next group.

I do not find Mormons to be corrupt as a given but I do find them to be more subject to nepotism, sweetheart deals and general disregard for ethical business practices. Are they from the italian province of Polermo? no, but nothing says Good Ol boys club better than Mormon business, and they don't let the help into the country club.
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_beastie
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Post by _beastie »

Part of the answer to this may have to do with the density of the LDS population. In areas with sparse LDS population, I doubt that the tendency towards social/class discrimination will be as prominent as it would be in areas with dense LDS population.
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