Newest pulpit mandate is highly ironic

[_Mercury]

http://deseretnews.com/article/1,5143,695261200,00.html

Its funny that an organization scamming millions of people out of ten percent if their earnings is ironically warning the dupes to watch out for con men.

[_Sam Harris]

Here in Utah, authorities said a majority of the fraud cases they encounter involve some level of "affinity fraud," which is an investment scam that preys upon members of a specific group — such as a religious or ethnic community.

Um, isn't that what the church does every time they tell a member they'll be blessed if they pay tithing?

[_The Nehor]

Last I checked the Church never promised to give that money back doubled or tripled, most scammers do.

[_SatanWasSetUp]

This warning comes out every 5-10 years or so. Maybe the church needs to try a different approach, since just telling members to beware of these scams apparently isn't working. There is something ingrained in Mormon culture that makes them susceptible to these types of scams. Multiple MLM topic threads get started on various LDS themed message boards. MLM seems to be a foreign concept outside of my Mormon circle.

[_SatanWasSetUp]

Last I checked the Church never promised to give that money back doubled or tripled, most scammers do.

But they do promise to give back blessings double or tripled. Remember, the windows of heaven will open and blessings will pour down upon you if you pay tithing. Although I don't think tithing quite fits in with the scams the church is warning about, because someone can just stop paying tithing, and the church won't bug you too much about it. But the church does promise blessings, and they also promise to withhold blessings from non-tithe payers. Isn't tithing referred to by many as "fire insurance?"

Preparing for Exaltation manual

Point out that we receive blessings when we pay tithing. Have class members read and mark Malachi 3:10.

• What do you think the Lord meant when he said “Prove me now herewith”? (To pay tithing and see that he really does keep his promises. Note that in this verse, the word prove means test.)

• How might the Lord “open … the windows of heaven” to bless us when we pay tithing?

Explain that the blessings the Lord may provide to people who pay tithing include the ability to earn enough money to provide for their needs, the ability to use money wisely, protection from costly catastrophes, and the joy of sharing and giving. Obedience to the law of tithing, like obedience to other commandments, also helps us feel the influence of the Holy Ghost in our lives.

Quotation and discussion
Have a class member read the following statement by President David O. McKay, ninth President of the Church:

“Tithing makes its greatest appeal to the sincere mind because of its spiritual significance. It is an unfailing source of spiritual power. True and constant obedience to this law will give as much spiritual development as will obedience to any other principle of the gospel” (Gospel Ideals [1953], 199).

• The Lord has promised to give us spiritual and material blessings when we pay a full tithe. How has the Lord blessed you or someone you know for paying tithing faithfully? (You may want to share an experience from your own life.)

That's quite an impressive sales pitch!

[_The Nehor]

That's quite an impressive sales pitch!

Yes, but the deal is with God, not the Church.

[_SatanWasSetUp]

Yes, but the deal is with God, not the Church.

Fine. And when God wants his money he can come down and ask me for it;) I actually do agree with you that tithing isn't in the same category as these other financial scams. There is a whole other category of religious scams out there that I am not a fan of. Selling blessings for money. What a crock. But the church isn't the only one raking in tons and tons of money from their members. However, I do think the MLM scams in the church are a big issue and I'm glad the church is continually trying to do something about it. I can't put my finger on what it is within Mormon culture that makes them so susceptible to these scams. Is it Mormonism or is it Utah Mormonism? Is there something about the business culture and economy of Utah that fosters these things?

[_Mercury]

That's quite an impressive sales pitch!

Yes, but the deal is with God, not the Church.

Really? When did God set down his portfolio management style? It seems that the Mormon elite are investing said funds. Tithing is a scam. Watch out Mormons!

[_The Nehor]

Yes, but the deal is with God, not the Church.

Fine. And when God wants his money he can come down and ask me for it;) I actually do agree with you that tithing isn't in the same category as these other financial scams. There is a whole other category of religious scams out there that I am not a fan of. Selling blessings for money. What a crock. But the church isn't the only one raking in tons and tons of money from their members. However, I do think the MLM scams in the church are a big issue and I'm glad the church is continually trying to do something about it. I can't put my finger on what it is within Mormon culture that makes them so susceptible to these scams. Is it Mormonism or is it Utah Mormonism? Is there something about the business culture and economy of Utah that fosters these things?

I think it has a lot to do with the social aspect of LDS culture. Most LDS know a lot of people and have a social network in which to sell crap to others. Everyone who has had band candy and girl scout cookie ordering forms passed around their office know how widespread these things are in a professional environment. In a casual environment it's much worse. Add in that the presenter usually thinks they're helping a friend out by making the offer and the recipient's general trust of the seller and you have insanity waiting to happen. I just had two married friends try to sell me stuff when they invited me over for dinner. I played with their kids during the pitch (to several people) and told them I was buying nothing not necessary for survival until all my student loans are paid off in full.

[_Mercury]

Yes, but the deal is with God, not the Church.

Fine. And when God wants his money he can come down and ask me for it;) I actually do agree with you that tithing isn't in the same category as these other financial scams. There is a whole other category of religious scams out there that I am not a fan of. Selling blessings for money. What a crock. But the church isn't the only one raking in tons and tons of money from their members. However, I do think the MLM scams in the church are a big issue and I'm glad the church is continually trying to do something about it. I can't put my finger on what it is within Mormon culture that makes them so susceptible to these scams. Is it Mormonism or is it Utah Mormonism? Is there something about the business culture and economy of Utah that fosters these things?

I think it has a lot to do with the social aspect of LDS culture. Most LDS know a lot of people and have a social network in which to sell crap to others. Everyone who has had band candy and girl scout cookie ordering forms passed around their office know how widespread these things are in a professional environment. In a casual environment it's much worse. Add in that the presenter usually thinks they're helping a friend out by making the offer and the recipient's general trust of the seller and you have insanity waiting to happen. I just had two married friends try to sell me stuff when they invited me over for dinner. I played with their kids during the pitch (to several people) and told them I was buying nothing not necessary for survival until all my student loans are paid off in full.

Do not make the laughable mistake of comparing MLM with girl scout cookies.