wenglund wrote:
What does this hypothetical have to do with "information gathering" by the Church and the alleged "hurt" caused thereby?
The hypothetical demonstrates, in a very small way, what the LDS Church does with its information gathering. If this kind of pesky, and arguably Orwellian kind of monitoring and pestering is the *most minor* "hurt" caused by Church surveillance, then I think we've got a significant problem on our hands.
Have you ruled out other plausible explanations for LDS folks happening to appear at the door?
Like what? Obviously, someone told these LDS members where this person was, and now here they are, at the door.
What happened, hypothetically, at the door, and what was the nature of "hurt" experienced by the someone who left the Church?
I don't know, Wade. It's merely a hypothetical to demonstrate that the LDS Church monitors members (and former members), and that it disregards the wishes of the individual.
Are you supposing that the same "hurt" will result each time this kind of hypothetical occurance happens?
I think you're changing the subject. As I've already pointed out, this is really the most minor sort of Church surveillance. The more serious kinds of monitoring include stuff like the various BYU spy rings, the attempts to hunt down Mike Quinn, threats made by Church Security to Mike Norton---that sort of stuff.
And, most importantly, why does this personally disquite you, particularly if it other people's business, and if it doesn't disquite or "hurt" all of them.
That the Church monitors people in order to later bully them around, discipline them, smear their reputations or otherwise ruin their lives, and that the Church does this via subterfuge and skullduggery---*that's* why I find it disquieting. The is supposed to be the Lord's One True Church. Why should any of this be necessary?
What do you estimate is the frequency of this happening?
What, of people getting "tracked down"? I would imagine it's fairly common. Why don't you go ask the folks at RfM?
Anyways, whether or not I'd fear this "minor" thing is beside the point, since we have documentary evidence that Church surveillance goes far, far beyond visits from missionaries and home teachers.
I don't know what point you have in mind, but my questions are very pertinent to the point I am exploring.
Thanks, -Wade Englund-
I thought the point you were exploring was whether or not anxiety about Church surveillance and monitoring is reasonable? I say, "yes," due to the extent it goes. And yet, here you are, trying to focus on the most minor manifestation of it. Wouldn't your best tactic be to attack the most egregious instances of Church spying/surveillance/etc.? Do you not find the anti-gay spy rings "disquieting"?