Time for periodic apologies yet again

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_beastie
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Post by _beastie »

Thank you to those who accepted the apology in good faith, as it was given.


Whether or not the apology was in good faith can only be demonstrated by future behavior.

You pretend to be the expert on Mormonism, but seem not to grasp a very basic teaching of Mormonism regarding repentance and forgiveness - it only works if you cease the offensive behavior. Otherwise, all your past acts return upon your head.

While you're at it, you should also apologize for your lewd behavior. And stop it.
We hate to seem like we don’t trust every nut with a story, but there’s evidence we can point to, and dance while shouting taunting phrases.

Penn & Teller

http://www.mormonmesoamerica.com
_Moniker
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Post by _Moniker »

Coggins7 wrote:Thank you to those who accepted the apology in good faith, as it was given.

To those who do not seem able to do this...

Well, you know, nothing to see here.


I have already forgiven you for every swipe against my intelligence, for every demeaning comment about my sexuality, for every condescending comment on my prior profession. I asked you to have compassion, I asked in a PM to please consider refraining from some of your comments -- I decided to bite back after you did not cease the behavior. Yet, I still forgive you. I assume there is a desire for you to feel superior.

Yet, I'm still not impressed by your apologies. The two are not correlated in my mind.

You've never asked for my forgiveness and yet, I did it anyway.
_Coggins7
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Post by _Coggins7 »

beastie wrote:
Thank you to those who accepted the apology in good faith, as it was given.


Whether or not the apology was in good faith can only be demonstrated by future behavior.

You pretend to be the expert on Mormonism, but seem not to grasp a very basic teaching of Mormonism regarding repentance and forgiveness - it only works if you cease the offensive behavior. Otherwise, all your past acts return upon your head.

While you're at it, you should also apologize for your lewd behavior. And stop it.



1. I pretend to nothing. I'll leave that to others here.

2. Lewd behavior? Care to back that up? Scratchesque character assassination. You just cannot help yourself, can you?
The face of sin today often wears the mask of tolerance.


- Thomas S. Monson
_beastie
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Post by _beastie »

1. I pretend to nothing. I'll leave that to others here.

2. Lewd behavior? Care to back that up? Scratchesque character assassination. You just cannot help yourself, can you?


Oh, excuse me, you genuinely believe your the expert on Mormon beliefs. As far as your lewd behavior, you often make sexually-tinged insinuations towards female posters, as if they were promiscuous. That, in my opinion, is lewd behavior.

No comment about the importance of abandoning the sin for true repentance, eh?

Keep apologizing over and over, coggins. But as long as you don't change, by Mormon teachings, it means nothing.
We hate to seem like we don’t trust every nut with a story, but there’s evidence we can point to, and dance while shouting taunting phrases.

Penn & Teller

http://www.mormonmesoamerica.com
_Mister Scratch
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Post by _Mister Scratch »

Coggins7 wrote:
beastie wrote:
Thank you to those who accepted the apology in good faith, as it was given.


Whether or not the apology was in good faith can only be demonstrated by future behavior.

You pretend to be the expert on Mormonism, but seem not to grasp a very basic teaching of Mormonism regarding repentance and forgiveness - it only works if you cease the offensive behavior. Otherwise, all your past acts return upon your head.

While you're at it, you should also apologize for your lewd behavior. And stop it.



1. I pretend to nothing. I'll leave that to others here.

2. Lewd behavior? Care to back that up? Scratchesque character assassination. You just cannot help yourself, can you?


Gee, I was all prepared to accept the apology, and now I'm being accused of "character assassination"? I really have to wonder about the sincerity of the apology.
_beastie
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Post by _beastie »

Here, coggins, this may help you understand true repentance:

http://LDS.org/ldsorg/v/index.jsp?vgnex ... RD&locale=
0&index=18&sourceId=51969daac5d98010VgnVCM1000004d82620a____

Elements of Repentance

Repentance is sometimes a painful process, but it leads to forgiveness and lasting peace. Through the prophet Isaiah, the Lord said, "Though your sins be as scarlet, they shall be as white as snow; though they be red like crimson, they shall be as wool" (Isaiah 1:18). In this dispensation the Lord has promised, "He who has repented of his sins, the same is forgiven, and I, the Lord, remember them no more" (D&C 58:42). Repentance includes the following elements:

Faith in Our Heavenly Father and Jesus Christ. The power of sin is great. To become free from it, we must turn to our Heavenly Father, pray in faith, and act as He asks us to. Satan may try to convince us that we are not worthy to pray—that our Father in Heaven is so displeased with us that He will never hear our prayers. This is a lie. Our Father in Heaven is always ready to help if we will come to Him with a repentant heart. He has the power to heal us and to help us triumph over sin.

Repentance is an act of faith in Jesus Christ—an acknowledgment of the power of His Atonement. We can be forgiven only on His terms. As we gratefully recognize His Atonement and His power to cleanse us from sin, we are able to "exercise [our] faith unto repentance" (Alma 34:17).

Sorrow for Sin. In order to be forgiven, we must first acknowledge within ourselves that we have sinned. If we are striving to live the gospel, such an acknowledgment will lead to "godly sorrow," which "worketh repentance to salvation" (2 Corinthians 7:10). Godly sorrow does not come because of the natural consequences of sin or because of a fear of punishment; rather, it comes from the knowledge that we have, through our actions, displeased our Heavenly Father and our Savior. When we experience godly sorrow, we have a sincere desire for change and a willingness to submit to every requirement for forgiveness.

Confession. "He that covereth his sins shall not prosper: but whoso confesseth and forsaketh them shall have mercy" (Proverbs 28:13). Essential to forgiveness is a willingness to disclose fully to our Heavenly Father all that we have done. We must kneel before Him in humble prayer, acknowledging our sins. We confess our shame and guilt, and then plead for help.

Serious transgressions, such as violations of the law of chastity, may jeopardize a person's membership in the Church. Therefore, such sins need to be confessed to both the Lord and His priesthood representatives in the Church. This is done under the care of a bishop or branch president and possibly a stake or mission president, who serve as watchmen and judges in the Church. While only the Lord can forgive sins, these priesthood leaders play a critical role in the process of repentance. They will keep confessions confidential and help throughout the process of repentance.

Abandonment of Sin. Although confession is an essential element of repentance, it is not enough. The Lord has said, "By this ye may know if a man repenteth of his sins—behold, he will confess them and forsake them" (D&C 58:43).

We must maintain an unyielding, permanent resolve that we will never repeat the transgression. When we keep this commitment, we will never experience the pain of that sin again. We must flee immediately from any compromising situation. If a certain situation causes us to sin or may cause us to sin, we must leave. We cannot linger in temptation and expect to overcome sin.

Restitution. We must restore as far as possible all that has been damaged by our actions, whether that is someone's property or someone's good reputation. Willing restitution shows the Lord that we will do all we can to repent.

Righteous Living. It is not enough to simply try to resist evil or empty our lives of sin. We must fill our lives with righteousness and engage in activities that bring spiritual power. We must immerse ourselves in the scriptures and pray daily for the Lord to give us strength beyond our own. At times, we should fast for special blessings.

Full obedience brings the complete power of the gospel into our lives, including increased strength to overcome our weaknesses. This obedience includes actions we might not initially consider part of repentance, such as attending meetings, paying tithing, giving service, and forgiving others. The Lord promised, "He that repents and does the commandments of the Lord shall be forgiven" (D&C 1:32).


and

http://LDS.org/ldsorg/v/index.jsp?vgnex ... RD&locale=
0&sourceId=695d46581c79b010VgnVCM1000004d82620a____&hideNav=1

“Q&A: Questions and Answers,” New Era, Mar 1974, 7–11

Answers are for help and perspective, not as pronouncements of Church doctrine.
“Should we continue forgiving a person who keeps doing wrong because that person is confident that he will be forgiven again?”

Vaughn J. Featherstone, “Q&A: Questions and Answers,” New Era, Mar. 1974, 7–9

Repentance is not a law to be trifled with. Woe unto him who sins with the idea of seeking repentance. He trifles with the very principles of salvation. The person who repents with the idea that he may sin again at a later time is not truly repenting; he is only ceasing his sinful activity for a period with the hope that it will salve his conscience. Then, under the false sense of repentance, the pressure to truly repent seems to be lifted and the sinful one may turn back to the sin.

In section 42 of the Doctrine and Covenants we read, “… he that … repents with all his heart, and forsaketh it, and doeth it no more, thou shalt forgive.” (D&C 42:25.) Now the Lord is speaking of a major transgression, but it is my feeling that the principle remains the same in all matters needing repentance. We must forsake sin with all our heart, and herein lies the motivation and inspiration from returning to the sin.



And straight from the mouth of THE LORD:

7 And now, verily I say unto you, I, the Lord, will not lay any sin to your charge; go your ways and sin no more; but unto that soul who sinneth shall the former sins return, saith the Lord your God.


D&C 82:7
We hate to seem like we don’t trust every nut with a story, but there’s evidence we can point to, and dance while shouting taunting phrases.

Penn & Teller

http://www.mormonmesoamerica.com
_Trevor
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Post by _Trevor »

Mister Scratch wrote:Gee, I was all prepared to accept the apology, and now I'm being accused of "character assassination"? I really have to wonder about the sincerity of the apology.


I think a few of us were implicitly omitted from this "general" apology.
_Coggins7
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Post by _Coggins7 »

Scratch, I'm apologizing for ad hominem attacks and mean spiritedness, and for allowing people, such as Beastie and Trevor, and Mercury, and you, to bait me (as Beastie and Trevor are both doing now) back into angry responses.

You are a character assassin, and I consider you to be a rather pathological liar, especially about other individuals, and I won't soon be remiss from pointing out obvious truths when they need pointing out. Nor do I think you are anyone to be standing watch over my posting behavior. I'll still call Hugh Hefner immoral, that not being an ad hominem attack, but a principled observation of the kind the scriptures make all the time and authorize the Saints to make in season. I am nothing , in regard to ad hominems, compared to a number of others here who are, as we speak, antecedent to my apology, now gloating over what they hope will be my return to giving as good as I get.

All I'm saying is I'm going to try mighty hard not to call you a dirtbag, or any such, regardless of what I really think.
The face of sin today often wears the mask of tolerance.


- Thomas S. Monson
_Coggins7
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Post by _Coggins7 »

Trevor wrote:
Mister Scratch wrote:Gee, I was all prepared to accept the apology, and now I'm being accused of "character assassination"? I really have to wonder about the sincerity of the apology.


I think a few of us were implicitly omitted from this "general" apology.



Apologies to all for any personal attacks within the previous 24 hours.



Yes, a few of you apparently missed the above, which I herewith extend to the last twelve months.
The face of sin today often wears the mask of tolerance.


- Thomas S. Monson
_truth dancer
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Post by _truth dancer »

Well, since I am one of those who was the recipient of some of your nastiness in the past 24 hours, I'll just say thanks for the apology.

I guess I am just used to it or something but more than anything the name calling makes me giggle. Not that I think it is kind or appropriate at all because it isn't (in my opinion), but for some reason I just can't help but picture children arguing on a playground.

Anyway, would it help you if we reminded you of your desire to be more respectful when you get in one of your moods?

:-)

~dancer~
"The search for reality is the most dangerous of all undertakings for it destroys the world in which you live." Nisargadatta Maharaj
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