Double Standard--Question for Will, et. al. from MAD

[_KimberlyAnn]

This most recent post, I would say, is possibly the most risible of all those that have preceded it __ and that is really saying something.

*You veel reveel your confederates, or ve veel keel you all.*

Yes, it reminds me of Mormon bishops who badger confessing, penitent congregants for the names of their sexual partners-in-crime.

The Bishop is, to his ward, the representative of the Lord on earth and whether or not the threat is stated, it is certainly implied: "Tell me with whom you sinned, or your eternal welfare may be at stake."

*You veel reveel your confederates, or ve veel damn you all.*

KA

[_The Dude]

This most recent post, I would say, is possibly the most risible of all those that have preceded it __ and that is really saying something.

If I am not mistaken, Will grew up on the wrong side of the tracks and spent some time behind bars in his youth. Despite the impressive vocabulary and grammar of our reformed Will Schryver, I suspect he still knows a thing or two about street justice, and how one might "take the fall" to protect one's homies. In this light, Gad's post is "apropos" as usual.

[_Daniel Peterson]

The fact that at least two members of FARMS other than DCP are monitoring this forum and enjoying Will's clumsy attempts at verbose put downs (lCoggins style) as well as the crude comments I think is fascinating.

Pardon me, but I don't think it a demonstrated "fact" that anybody from FARMS -- including myself -- is "monitoring" this wretched board. Is Tarski "monitoring" it? Is poor antishock8 "monitoring" it? Is Liz or Beastie "monitoring" it?

I can't absolutely guarantee that nobody with any connection at all to FARMS reads this board. We've published roughly three hundred different authors, and we have thousands of subscribers. But I'm positive that nobody has been asked by FARMS or the Maxwell Institute to "monitor" it; neither this board nor the board formerly known as FAIR has ever come up, even once, in any meeting of the leadership of the Institute nor in any conversation that I've ever had with any of them, and I'm reasonably confident that they don't even know that these two boards exist.

But has Will really claimed that these two alleged FARMS monitors actively follow everything he's said here, or that they've been looking in recently, or that they've ever done anything more than take a glance at this place and perhaps even at only a single thread?

I call upon Will to reveal these FARMS participants this instant in the name of the greater moral good. Who are they, Will? If Will won't answer, then I demand the FARMS associates who Will refers to: Register and reveal yourselves immediatley. The fact that Will has said as much as he has implicates all of FARMS except DCP until the culprits come clean.

Good grief. It seems that we're back right in the middle of Scratchworld. With apologies to the great Leonard Cohen, even when Scratch isn't here "his spirit continues to drool."

This is exactly like the case in grade school where you have a ring of friends, two of them do something wrong, suspicion is cast on the whole group, and it becomes to duty of the wrongdoers to admit their guilt at least for the sake of proving their friends' innocence in front of the class. Failure to do so is to act as a traitor towards one's friends. Will has already sold out his buddies, we'll see if these three kids (at least three) will sell out the rest of their group by not coming clean all the way.

What fatuous idiocy. There's no evidence that any "wrongdoing" has occurred here, nor that your two anonymous suspects even exist.

[_Gadianton]

Dr. Peterson,

I'm sorry, but you're going to have to take your objections up with Will. It was not my idea for him to drop that unexpected bombshell. There is proof that at least two FARMS associates are enjoying Will's crude comments, per Will. That's proof enough because I believe Will to be a man of his word.

Now the credibility of every participant with FARMS hangs in the balance. They are all suspect. Perhaps Will will do the right thing and pony up a list of names, and let the others not involved with this incident have their names cleared.

[_Daniel Peterson]

Now the credibility of every participant with FARMS hangs in the balance. They are all suspect.

Sorry, but this strikes me as simply lunatic.

People who've never even heard of this sorry place are guilty until they prove themselves innocent of the unevidenced charges you've made here?

They'd be trembling in their boots, if they only knew.

Perhaps Will will do the right thing and pony up a list of names, and let the others not involved with this incident have their names cleared.

You need a silent movie organist to lay on the mood music for this one.

[_Chap]

Dr. Peterson is, arguably, the most prominent Latter-day Saint who monitors this board and posts here. He is a BYU professor, editor of the FARMS review, etc.

Actually, Dr. Peterson HAS called Will on it in two ways:

He has publicly stated MULTIPLE times now, on both this thread, and the other one I started, that he does NOT approve of the crude types of posts that Will has delivered here.

He also serves as an example of an LDS apologist who can argue positions, and post his opinions without being crude and ugly to others.

Frankly, if Will chooses to ignore both Dr. Peterson's opinion regarding his posts, and his example of posting, then I question Will's respect for Dr. Peterson.

All due respect, Liz, but Dr. Peterson hasn't issued any unequivocal, specific denouncement of Will's behavior on MDB (which, to show my cards, is what I'm after). He has stated that he doesn't like potty humor, that he misses more posts than I'd think, and that I shouldn't judge his religion based on its most extreme adherents. What he hasn't said is, "I disdain Will's disgusting comments." Or, something to that effect.

I'm hoping that Dr. Peterson, as a thoughtful representative of the Restored Gospel of Jesus Christ, will forthrightly condemn LDS Will's antics here--because it is the right thing to do for someone who professes to represent Jesus Christ. Will feels no shame whatsoever for his antics and would repeat them again tomorrow, per his own claims. (And, perhaps he can call me a "cowardly liar" again for feeling repulsed by him.)

This is a win-(sorta-)win challenge on my part.

I'd be pleased as punch for Dr. Peterson to do so; yet, at this point, frankly, I think I'd be unsurprised if he doesn't.

I have already pointed out DCP's tactic of expressing general distaste for crudity of language and expression, without once (in his long, long series of postings on this insignificant board and in this unimportant thread) saying that any of Schryver's obscenity-laden posts fall into the category he finds distasteful. Could this be the old 'Don't publicly disrespect a priesthood holder' taboo at work?

[_Joey]

Pardon me, but I don't think it a demonstrated "fact" that anybody from FARMS -- including myself -- is "monitoring" this wretched board.

This is how it works with Mr. Peterson. At first he claimed that no one associated with FARMS "pays any attention" to this board. As soon as he was proven wrong with that, he changed the defining criteria (which LDS apologists must do for a living) to "monitoring".

His next criteria to save face will be that no one associated with FARMS is "transcribing" this board on a daily basis.

Oh well, what else does he have to do with his time as a supposed "professor"??!!! The insulation and isolation of Provo is a good thing for him!!!!![/i]

[_Chap]

Oh well, what else does he have to do with his time as a supposed "professor"??!!! The insulation and isolation of Provo is a good thing for him!!!!![/i]

DCP does actually have a job in a US university, which conventionally confers on most regular teaching staff the title of 'professor', so you have to give him his due on that point - there is nothing to 'suppose' about his title.

I do agree however that the intellectual and moral culture of Provo may have special features that are more marked in some departments than others. See my post above, for instance.

[_Yoda]

DCP does actually have a job in a US university, which conventionally confers on most regular teaching staff the title of 'professor', so you have to give him his due on that point - there is nothing to 'suppose' about his title.

Agreed. And can I just state a semi-off topic pet peeve of mine, for what it's worth?

You folks who are referring to Dr. Peterson as "Mr. Peterson" simply to denigrate his title need to knock it off.

The man earned a PhD. He deserves the title of "Dr."

I suppose I'm rather sensitive about this point because I'm working on my doctorate at the moment, and it is HARD WORK. The title is duly earned.

OK, rant off. LOL

[_Chap]

DCP does actually have a job in a US university, which conventionally confers on most regular teaching staff the title of 'professor', so you have to give him his due on that point - there is nothing to 'suppose' about his title.

Agreed. And can I just state a semi-off topic pet peeve of mine, for what it's worth?

You folks who are referring to Dr. Peterson as "Mr. Peterson" simply to denigrate his title need to knock it off.

The man earned a PhD. He deserves the title of "Dr."

I suppose I'm rather sensitive about this point because I'm working on my doctorate at the moment, and it is HARD WORK. The title is duly earned.

OK, rant off. LOL

People on this board are free to call one another what they like. And do ...

But without specific reference to DCP, I should just like to ask you to join me in deflating the PhD pretension just a little.

Most anyone who can pass an undergraduate degree at a respectable level, and can continue the underpaid slog for a few more years under a competent supervisor can write a PhD dissertation that will get passed. Genius is not required. The whole graduate school business is just a rite of passage or apprenticeship, and anyone who has been around a university for long learns not to expect too much by way of brilliance from someone just because they got throught the PhD mill.