For the Atheists-What kind of God would you accept?

[_Mad Viking]

God wants people to simply have faith that he prefers faith to intellectual knowledge.

YES!!!! Though I think once you have faith the other often follows. You yourself said that the knowledge of God doesn't help. Faith does. Faith impels to action. It urges you to do what God says.

If I could prove to every critic here that the LDS faith is accurate and that God exists do you really think they would all start doing their Home Teaching and spend the rest of their lives trying to bring their lives into conformity with God's will? I don't. What good will their membership and belief/intellectual acceptance do? None at all. What harm could it do? Lots. I don't think the Saints really want hundreds and thousands of people clogging up our records who join simply because they think our God is real. Think of the Home and Visiting Teaching issues.......

I was refering to the belief in God helping the state of the world. Faith = Belief. So yes faith/belief in God doesn't help much toward proving his existence.

[_The Nehor]

Hmm .. Lets try this:
Dad cares much more for those children of his who will worship him and seek to emulate him then and cares little for his other children who believe he is alive ..

I am sorry, you worship a petty small being ..

Nope, he cares for everyone which is why except for a very few who hate him and want nothing to do with him (whose wish he then grants) he's provided kingdoms of glory beyond description for everyone. However, he's decided not to pass out the rank of Godhood to everyone in existence. You call this petty, I call it sanity. I'm nowhere near ready for that kind of power and I'm theoretically on the path to get there.....can you imagine if he gave this power to some of the people you've met on the street? (shudder)

[_The Nehor]

God wants people to simply have faith that he prefers faith to intellectual knowledge.

YES!!!! Though I think once you have faith the other often follows. You yourself said that the knowledge of God doesn't help. Faith does. Faith impels to action. It urges you to do what God says.

If I could prove to every critic here that the LDS faith is accurate and that God exists do you really think they would all start doing their Home Teaching and spend the rest of their lives trying to bring their lives into conformity with God's will? I don't. What good will their membership and belief/intellectual acceptance do? None at all. What harm could it do? Lots. I don't think the Saints really want hundreds and thousands of people clogging up our records who join simply because they think our God is real. Think of the Home and Visiting Teaching issues.......

I was refering to the belief in God helping the state of the world. Faith = Belief. So yes faith/belief in God doesn't help much toward proving his existence.

Faith does not equal belief. I believe that I should stop putting mayonnaise on my sandwiches. I don't have enough faith to stop yet. Many people believe they should lose weight. Many don't have the faith to do anything about it.

[_Mad Viking]

God wants people to simply have faith that he prefers faith to intellectual knowledge.

YES!!!! Though I think once you have faith the other often follows. You yourself said that the knowledge of God doesn't help. Faith does. Faith impels to action. It urges you to do what God says.

If I could prove to every critic here that the LDS faith is accurate and that God exists do you really think they would all start doing their Home Teaching and spend the rest of their lives trying to bring their lives into conformity with God's will? I don't. What good will their membership and belief/intellectual acceptance do? None at all. What harm could it do? Lots. I don't think the Saints really want hundreds and thousands of people clogging up our records who join simply because they think our God is real. Think of the Home and Visiting Teaching issues.......

I was refering to the belief in God helping the state of the world. Faith = Belief. So yes faith/belief in God doesn't help much toward proving his existence.

Faith does not equal belief. I believe that I should stop putting mayonnaise on my sandwiches. I don't have enough faith to stop yet. Many people believe they should lose weight. Many don't have the faith to do anything about it.

Mish-mash.

For the sake of this discussion please establish a definition of faith.

[_The Nehor]

Detractor: There is no objective evidence that god exists.

Believer: Yes, and God doesn't mind that much.

Detractor: Why?

Believer: Because he prefers believers who have faith in addition to the evidence that follows faith.

Detractor: How do you know that God prefers that we have faith in preference to evidence?

Believer: Because he told me so.

Fixed if I'm the believer in this example.

[_Mad Viking]

Detractor: There is no objective evidence that god exists.

Believer: Yes, and God doesn't mind that much.

Detractor: Why?

Believer: Because he prefers believers who have faith in addition to the evidence that follows faith.

Detractor: How do you know that God prefers that we have faith in preference to evidence?

Believer: Because he told me so.

Fixed if I'm the believer in this example.

Since your revisions are based on FAITH, the circular logic continues.

Source: American Heritage Dictionary
Faith - noun
1. Confident belief in the truth, value, or trustworthiness of a person, idea, or thing.
2. Belief that does not rest on logical proof or material evidence. See Synonyms at belief, trust.
3. Loyalty to a person or thing; allegiance: keeping faith with one's supporters.
often Faith Christianity The theological virtue defined as secure belief in God and a trusting acceptance of God's will.
4. The body of dogma of a religion: the Muslim faith.
5. A set of principles or beliefs.

[_The Nehor]

Mish-mash.

For the sake of this discussion please establish a definition of faith.

Sure, faith is first hope and then knowledge carried through to it's logical conclusions. It is the moving cause of every proactive decision we make. I'm at work right now because I have faith I'll be paid. I went to class last night because I have faith in my ability to learn. I lifted weights this morning because I have faith it will make me stronger. I said my prayers this morning because I have Faith God listened and would answer (and he did). I try to live my life in conformity with the gospel of Jesus Christ because I have faith in Jesus Christ's atonement and want it to wash me clean so that I can return clean to the presence of God.

I should add that there is such a thing as false faith. If I have faith that I can jump off my balcony and fly it will not make it so. This is why the first principle of the gospel is Faith in Jesus Christ, not Faith in a general sense.

[_The Nehor]

Since your revisions are based on FAITH, the circular logic continues.

Source: American Heritage Dictionary
Faith - noun
1. Confident belief in the truth, value, or trustworthiness of a person, idea, or thing.
2. Belief that does not rest on logical proof or material evidence. See Synonyms at belief, trust.
3. Loyalty to a person or thing; allegiance: keeping faith with one's supporters.
often Faith Christianity The theological virtue defined as secure belief in God and a trusting acceptance of God's will.
4. The body of dogma of a religion: the Muslim faith.
5. A set of principles or beliefs.

That's not what the LDS mean when they talk about faith. Since there is no word in the English language to use instead we're stuck with what we've got. I'm using the definition Joseph Smith used. Since this is a discussion of Morrmonism I think the Mormon definition should be considered the default use.

[_guy sajer]

And you know this about God just how . . . ?

It amazes me that people claim to know so much about a being that they've never seen or talked to.

And given what you've said, and assuming that Mormonism is the only true religion as claimed and alone possesses knowledge of the true God and his doctrine, then .01% of the world worships and emulates him as he would prefer that they do.

God's doing a pretty piss poor job of it even if we accept your explanation. (And by the way, I have no reason to accept that you understand God better than anyone else, so I'm not granting you your arguments.)

I know this about God through a combination of means. Some he told me and some I inferred. Oh, and I have talked to God. Seen? Well, check the thread archives. :)

I think humanity is doing a piss poor job. Where do people get this odd idea that because something is the best that people will flock to it in droves despite all historical evidence to the contrary?

Well, if the purpose of 'man' is that 'he might have joy' (paraphrasing from Book of Mormon), and the 'gospel' is a key to joy, and God's great plan for his children involves bringing his gospel to .01% of humanity, then, yes, I'd say he's doing a pretty piss poor job.

[_The Nehor]

And you know this about God just how . . . ?

It amazes me that people claim to know so much about a being that they've never seen or talked to.

And given what you've said, and assuming that Mormonism is the only true religion as claimed and alone possesses knowledge of the true God and his doctrine, then .01% of the world worships and emulates him as he would prefer that they do.

God's doing a pretty piss poor job of it even if we accept your explanation. (And by the way, I have no reason to accept that you understand God better than anyone else, so I'm not granting you your arguments.)

I know this about God through a combination of means. Some he told me and some I inferred. Oh, and I have talked to God. Seen? Well, check the thread archives. :)

I think humanity is doing a piss poor job. Where do people get this odd idea that because something is the best that people will flock to it in droves despite all historical evidence to the contrary?

Well, if the purpose of 'man' is that 'he might have joy' (paraphrasing from Book of Mormon), and the 'gospel' is a key to joy, and God's great plan for his children involves bringing his gospel to .01% of humanity, then, yes, I'd say he's doing a pretty piss poor job.

Okay, God sucks because people choose misery? Not seeing how that's his fault. There was a Luciferian viewpoint he could have taken up that would have ensured the choices made would be different but I don't think it would have increased joy.