The Space Between Us

[_Runtu]

Utterly disgusting, how naked evil can manifest itself as gentle, bittersweet regrets bathed in the most nauseating, flaccid self exculpatory rationalization imaginable.

The quiet, sensitive Runtu finally unsheathes his velvet claws.

Well, that was unexpected. Care to elaborate?

[_truth dancer]

I think Loran forgot to read the Ensign article on how to treat others online.

;-)



~dancer~

[_Yoda]

Utterly disgusting, how naked evil can manifest itself as gentle, bittersweet regrets bathed in the most nauseating, flaccid self exculpatory rationalization imaginable.

The quiet, sensitive Runtu finally unsheathes his velvet claws.

You're an idiot.

I was thinking ass, but idiot will work. ;)

[_antishock8]

You guys do realize you're dealing with someone on medication, no? Just a head's up...

[_Pokatator]

I was reading about LDS divorce rates for another thread and was reminded that the divorce rate in "mixed" marriages (between LDS and nonLDS) is 40%. Forty percent. I imagine the divorce rate between believing Mormon and apostate is even higher.

When one is a believing Mormon, Mormonism almost completely defines one's life. Certainly we were taught that shared religious conviction was THE most important criteria to look for in a future spouse. When I was at BYU, SWK made statements that implied that if the couple shared a devotion to the church, other differences were irrelevant, and they could have "great happiness". That only works if your life completely revolves around the church. But if that stops....then what do you have?

My heart breaks for you, runtu, and others in the same position. The one good thing about my marital situation when I left the church is that I didn't have a marriage worth saving in the first place, so that wasn't even a factor in my decision.

I think LDS couples who end up married well - not just sharing faith, but compatibility and the ability to enjoy one another - are lucky indeed. I really do not believe the LDS culture is particularly good at helping its youngsters marry well.

Mixed marriages that survive the loss of faith usually have to have some sort of strong bond outside the faith.

The one good thing about my marital situation when I left the church is that I didn't have a marriage worth saving in the first place, so that wasn't even a factor in my decision.

That was my situation exactly.

I really do not believe the LDS culture is particularly good at helping its youngsters marry well.

That is so true.

Thanx Beastie for this post and Runtu thanx for the OP.

[_Jason Bourne]

I think LDS couples who end up married well - not just sharing faith, but compatibility and the ability to enjoy one another - are lucky indeed. I really do not believe the LDS culture is particularly good at helping its youngsters marry well.

Mixed marriages that survive the loss of faith usually have to have some sort of strong bond outside the faith.

The evidence that faithful LDS couples stay married and seemingly stay happily married seems to contradict your opinion.

[_Runtu]

I think LDS couples who end up married well - not just sharing faith, but compatibility and the ability to enjoy one another - are lucky indeed. I really do not believe the LDS culture is particularly good at helping its youngsters marry well.

Mixed marriages that survive the loss of faith usually have to have some sort of strong bond outside the faith.

The evidence that faithful LDS couples stay married and seemingly stay happily married seems to contradict your opinion.

I think what beastie is saying is that the church becomes the central bond of the relationship in many cases. I know it was for us.

[_harmony]

LDS see you as the one who is severely limited, and that you're limiting your wife's choices.

And we do notice that this is phrased as if coming from one...outside the LDS Church.


Freudian slip?

Look across the aisle when you next attend the temple, Loran. One of those women might be harmony.

Oh wait. You don't have a TR. I do. Guess I won't be seeing you there any time soon.

[_harmony]

I think LDS couples who end up married well - not just sharing faith, but compatibility and the ability to enjoy one another - are lucky indeed. I really do not believe the LDS culture is particularly good at helping its youngsters marry well.

Mixed marriages that survive the loss of faith usually have to have some sort of strong bond outside the faith.

The evidence that faithful LDS couples stay married and seemingly stay happily married seems to contradict your opinion.

But do LDS couples where one of the partners leaves the church stay married at the same rate? And how can anyone know this, since the church won't turn loose of the numbers?

We have 65 couples in my ward. In the 30+ years I've lived here, we've had less than 10 divorces. That should be a number worth believing.

[_beastie]

The evidence that faithful LDS couples stay married and seemingly stay happily married seems to contradict your opinion.

Leaving aside the “seem happy” component, because that is so subjective, notice how you had to specify “faithful” LDS in your response. I recently read that the divorce stats for mixed marriages with an LDS is 40%, second only to the failure rate for mixed marriages with a Jewish person, which is 42%.

What I think this indicates is that LDS marriages are only “good” and “strong” when both people are active LDS. As soon as that parameter is lost, the divorce rate skyrockets – that leads me to question just how good and strong those marriages ever were in the first place.

in my opinion, marriages that are truly good, truly strong, are marriages that can weather the changes and challenges of life. People rarely stay the same throughout their lives. Our ideas change. We change in some ways. If a marriage can only remain intact if both partners don’t change their ideas about a certain ideology, I think it’s built on a sandy foundation.

The reason I don’t think LDS do a good job preparing their kids for marriage is that they totally stigmatize ANY sexual release, including masturbation. The end result is that you have a bunch of young adults who are so sexually frustrated and needed that they lose their common sense. They marry people they’ve only known months. They marry people they barely know. On top of that, you have the teaching that this is a decision that can be made through revelation, an incredibly vague process very susceptible to emotions and internal states. Throw in the teachings of some past leaders that the most important consideration is strength of testimony, and you have a bunch of kids who end up marrying someone they can only remain married to if they both continue to believe. And face it, that belief provides a very strong disinclination to divorce due to the stigma attached to it – even if the couple isn’t that happy. Even unhappy couples can put on a good face at church.

If any of my kids decided to marry someone they’d only known a few months, I’d freak out. But this is very common within the LDS culture. I don’t think there is any way to put a good spin on that.