Moral failure of LDS Leadership in Iraq invasion by US.

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_The Nehor
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Re: Moral failure of LDS Leadership in Iraq invasion by US.

Post by _The Nehor »

GoodK wrote:Homosexual marriage isn't. Makes your point seem rather moot, no?


Yes, because homosexual relationships are so monogamous. Check the numbers.
"Surely he knows that DCP, The Nehor, Lamanite, and other key apologists..." -Scratch clarifying my status in apologetics
"I admit it; I'm a petty, petty man." -Some Schmo
_GoodK

Re: Moral failure of LDS Leadership in Iraq invasion by US.

Post by _GoodK »

The Nehor wrote:
GoodK wrote:Homosexual marriage isn't. Makes your point seem rather moot, no?


Yes, because homosexual relationships are so monogamous. Check the numbers.


No.

You said sexual activity, including "lots of homosexual sex" leads to the destruction. Even if that is true - it has nothing to do with whether homosexual marriage is legally recognized.
_The Nehor
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Re: Moral failure of LDS Leadership in Iraq invasion by US.

Post by _The Nehor »

GoodK wrote:No.

You said sexual activity, including "lots of homosexual sex" leads to the destruction. Even if that is true - it has nothing to do with whether homosexual marriage is legally recognized.


Unless you are suggesting that homosexual couples are celibate then homosexual sex does have to do with homosexual marriage.
"Surely he knows that DCP, The Nehor, Lamanite, and other key apologists..." -Scratch clarifying my status in apologetics
"I admit it; I'm a petty, petty man." -Some Schmo
_GoodK

Re: Moral failure of LDS Leadership in Iraq invasion by US.

Post by _GoodK »

The Nehor wrote:
GoodK wrote:No.

You said sexual activity, including "lots of homosexual sex" leads to the destruction of society. Even if that is true - it has nothing to do with whether homosexual marriage is legally recognized.


Unless you are suggesting that homosexual couples are celibate then homosexual sex does have to do with homosexual marriage.



Wow. How does that make any sense?

I am suggesting that homosexual sex will occur whether or not marriage certificates are granted to homosexual couples.

You are suggesting that a good reason for the church to oppose homosexual marriage is "sexually libertine" societies and "lots of homosexual sex" leads to the downfall of a society.

Once again, this has little or nothing to do with a marriage certificate.

I don't think your argument is a very good one, Nehor. If anything, I think it is an excuse to justify feeling icky about gay marriage.
_GoodK

Re: Moral failure of LDS Leadership in Iraq invasion by US.

Post by _GoodK »

delete
Last edited by _GoodK on Fri Aug 22, 2008 4:13 pm, edited 1 time in total.
_harmony
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Re: Moral failure of LDS Leadership in Iraq invasion by US.

Post by _harmony »

The Nehor wrote:I never backpedaled. My point was always that sexually libertine societies are self-destructive. Homosexuality is a part of that.


Then I suggest you attribute the downfall of our present society/family based system to the rampant bad behavior of heterosexuals, since homosexuals can certainly not be blamed for our 50% divorce rate nor for the significant numbers of heterosexuals who have affairs, fornicate often, and generally create havoc among their families.

Is our society sexually libertine? Yup, probably. Homosexuality a part of that? Relatively little, actually. We heterosexuals can shoulder most of the blame for whatever is destroying our society.
(Nevo, Jan 23) And the Melchizedek Priesthood may not have been restored until the summer of 1830, several months after the organization of the Church.
_The Nehor
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Re: Moral failure of LDS Leadership in Iraq invasion by US.

Post by _The Nehor »

GoodK wrote:Wow. How does that make any sense?

I am suggesting that homosexual sex will occur whether or not marriage certificates are granted to homosexual couples.

You are suggesting that a good reason for the church to oppose homosexual marriage is "sexually libertine" societies and "lots of homosexual sex" leads to the downfall of a society.

Once again, this has little or nothing to do with a marriage certificate.

I don't think your argument is a very good one, Nehor. If anything, I think it is an excuse to justify feeling icky about gay marriage.


Once something is legitimized it becomes more likely to happen. A lot more people who identify as straight experiment with homosexuality then did ten years ago, more will happen if we legitimize homosexuality. Homosexuals will move more openly.
"Surely he knows that DCP, The Nehor, Lamanite, and other key apologists..." -Scratch clarifying my status in apologetics
"I admit it; I'm a petty, petty man." -Some Schmo
_The Nehor
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Re: Moral failure of LDS Leadership in Iraq invasion by US.

Post by _The Nehor »

harmony wrote:
The Nehor wrote:I never backpedaled. My point was always that sexually libertine societies are self-destructive. Homosexuality is a part of that.


Then I suggest you attribute the downfall of our present society/family based system to the rampant bad behavior of heterosexuals, since homosexuals can certainly not be blamed for our 50% divorce rate nor for the significant numbers of heterosexuals who have affairs, fornicate often, and generally create havoc among their families.

Is our society sexually libertine? Yup, probably. Homosexuality a part of that? Relatively little, actually. We heterosexuals can shoulder most of the blame for whatever is destroying our society.


They can't be blamed for all of it. Some of it? Yes. The LDS Church is fighting the war on both fronts. The legal battle continues in only one. We're not likely to be able to criminalize adultery.
"Surely he knows that DCP, The Nehor, Lamanite, and other key apologists..." -Scratch clarifying my status in apologetics
"I admit it; I'm a petty, petty man." -Some Schmo
_harmony
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Re: Moral failure of LDS Leadership in Iraq invasion by US.

Post by _harmony »

The Nehor wrote:They can't be blamed for all of it. Some of it? Yes.


A significant percentage? No. Put the blame for our society's mistakes where it belongs, Nehor: largely on the shoulders of the hetersexual population.

The LDS Church is fighting the war on both fronts. The legal battle continues in only one. We're not likely to be able to criminalize adultery.


The LDS church isn't striving to criminalize homosexual marriage either, Nehor. Try to not confuse homosexual marriage with polygamy and bigamy... those are heterosexual crimes.
(Nevo, Jan 23) And the Melchizedek Priesthood may not have been restored until the summer of 1830, several months after the organization of the Church.
_The Nehor
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Re: Moral failure of LDS Leadership in Iraq invasion by US.

Post by _The Nehor »

harmony wrote:
The Nehor wrote:They can't be blamed for all of it. Some of it? Yes.


A significant percentage? No. Put the blame for our society's mistakes where it belongs, Nehor: largely on the shoulders of the hetersexual population.

The LDS Church is fighting the war on both fronts. The legal battle continues in only one. We're not likely to be able to criminalize adultery.


The LDS church isn't striving to criminalize homosexual marriage either, Nehor. Try to not confuse homosexual marriage with polygamy and bigamy... those are heterosexual crimes.


A significant percentage? Yes. I'll put the blame where it belongs. I don't see homosexuality as more or less dangerous then heterosexual infidelity. However, arguing that one form of sexual infidelity is more dangerous then another is silly. Is burglary less of a problem to society because more people are engaged in fraud?

We're not criminalizing homosexual marriage, we just want it to stay illegal. I think the analogy works.

I've been taking a lot of heat lately with people insisting that I make such a big deal out of homosexuality and that I ignore heterosexual sexual problems. Let me clarify. I think an adulterer is as bad as a practicing homosexual. I think a philanderer (married or not) is in the same category. Why I think that anyone having sex outside marriage (whether it's hetero or homo sex) is making a horrible mistake just short of murder. If there were more threads on heterosexual promiscuity I'd be just as annoying there.
"Surely he knows that DCP, The Nehor, Lamanite, and other key apologists..." -Scratch clarifying my status in apologetics
"I admit it; I'm a petty, petty man." -Some Schmo
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