Steve Young's wife opposes prop 8 with $25K

[_TAK]

No, even if D&C 89 does not explicitly prohibit some things, the living prophets have indicated otherwise.

And as we have seen future prophets will Trump current ones..

[_asbestosman]

Yes, I wish God would let me try a little wine or coffee, but since I wanted His guidance, I'm going to follow it.

You're now equating what has become a commandment in the church to how to vote on a political issue?

What, is there a logical reason that the scope of God's guidance is limited? If we believe in God, and God guides us in politics, then I think we ought to heed His counsel.

I think this goes to the root of the problem. I do not believe it is the place of this church or any other church to tell its members how to vote. The LDS church has no business calling or appointing its members to campaign and raise cash on behalf of this misguided ballot measure. And it has even less business telling its members how to vote on it.

Well I don't share your opinion. Frankly, I'm not even sure why the government "punishes" (by removing tax-exempt status) religions if they become too political. But hey, in a mobacracy you can do almost any fool thing you can get enough votes for.

[_Rollo Tomasi]

You really think the LDS Church is attempting to use compulsion?

Not physical, but emotional/mental. How else does the Church so effectively quash dissent?

You must think the Church is very powerful if they are able to warp reality and make instruction and compulsion the same thing.

Just semantics. For example, during one talk GBH mentions that the Brethren take the position that females have no more than one pair of earrings, and before long the BYU Honor Code and "For the Strength of Youth" pamphlet include it as part of the dress code, and then you have Bednar relating how an RM dumped the girl he was considering marrying because she dared wear two pair of earrings and not following the prophet.

In conclusion, you're an idiot.

Nice rejoinder.

[_asbestosman]

And as we have seen future prophets will Trump current ones..

Jesus started the tradition with the Sermon on the Mount where He talked about what was written in the Law but then gave a stricter commandment afterwards.

[_Brother of Mahonri]

[quote="asbestosman]I follow the guidance of the living prophets. This ain't rocket science.

p.s. According to "His" words, its OK to drink coffee, as long as its iced coffee. Its the temperature that matters, not what the drink is. Well OK wine and Strong drinks are also proscribed even if they are cold. So if you want to obey "His" words and drink alcohol, you should stick to an ice cold beer. Cheers!

No, even if D&C 89 does not explicitly prohibit some things, the living prophets have indicated otherwise.[/quote]

"His" words are, unless you are an apostate like me, the words of THE LORD himself. The WoW not only does not explicitly prohibit beer, it says its good for you. Now there is one thing me and the Lord agree on. I understand completely how a living prophet Trump's a dead one, that first question was rhethorical, but since when does a dead prophet (Heber Grant - the prohibitionist that invented the WoW as it is known today) or even a live one Trump the explicit word of the LORD?

[_asbestosman]

Hey Abman...

If we aren't going to listen to the guidance of the prophets, then what's the point of being a member?

Oh dear... so which is it?

Obey the prophet?

Or follow your personal revelation/inspiration?

It sounds like you are suggesting that, "once the prophet speaks the speaking has been done".

What I'm actually saying is that if you believe the prophet speaks God's words, then you probably ought to follow them. If your personal revelation/inspiration contradicts the words of the prophets, then perhaps you ought to figure out whether the prophet is really preaching God's words and whether the church is really true. If you conclude that such is not the case, then it doesn't make much sense to fork over 10% of income + lots of time to be a member.

I know for a fact there are members whose personal views are not aligned with the church stance regarding this issue... should they listen to their own inspiration or disregard their personal revelation and obey the prophet?

They should re-evalutate the relationship between God, the prophets, the church, and themselves and figure out where they want to be.

[_asbestosman]

"His" words are, unless you are an apostate like me, the words of THE LORD himself.

That's only half-right. His words also come throught the living prophets.

I understand completely how a living prophet Trump's a dead one, that first question was rhethorical, but since when does a dead prophet (Heber Grant - the prohibitionist that invented the WoW as it is known today) or even a live one Trump the explicit word of the LORD?

They are all the word of the Lord. The latest commandment of the Lord Trump's earlier ones. This is how it works with law, parental rules, etc. Most kindergarteners understand this principle.

[_The Nehor]

You really think the LDS Church is attempting to use compulsion?

Not physical, but emotional/mental. How else does the Church so effectively quash dissent?

You must think the Church is very powerful if they are able to warp reality and make instruction and compulsion the same thing.

Just semantics. For example, during one talk GBH mentions that the Brethren take the position that females have no more than one pair of earrings, and before long the BYU Honor Code and "For the Strength of Youth" pamphlet include it as part of the dress code, and then you have Bednar relating how an RM dumped the girl he was considering marrying because she dared wear two pair of earrings and not following the prophet.

In conclusion, you're an idiot.

Nice rejoinder.

We don't quash dissent. You and Scratch are still alive. The so-called September Six are still hailed as martyrs by some loons and live their lives. We have a jackbooted thug organization which has been shown to have once asked a man to meet with two people to discuss the gospel....and that is basically all the evidence we have of what they do. They suck at quashing dissent.

Yes, and when I go to Church I have NEVER seen anyone breaking the earring rule. We suck at quashing dissent.

I present this as further proof for my earlier idiot assertion.

[_asbestosman]

If we aren't going to listen to the guidance of the prophets, then what's the point of being a member?

Gee, it appears Lucifer's premortal plan has worked!

Only in His dreams which you hopefully do not share.

This is different than Lucifer's plan. People can choose to retain their church membership through obediance. Satan's plan would have given us no choice between obeying and disobeying.

[_asbestosman]

I present this as further proof for my earlier idiot assertion.

The best evidence of idiocy is that someone is willing to argue with idiots . . . ;)