Scottie wrote:Yes, I think you're missing a HUGE 3rd bar where it apparently happens, but can't be explained away.
I was listening to the radio this morning and they were talking about EVP's. Sorry, but radio interference and baby monitors just don't cut it. I have no explanation.
All of the signals out there and this one bothers you? You combine all the possible sources of transmission interference mixed with human beings hyper-pattern matching bias and you have no problem explaining this. It definitely doesn't warrant a third bar.
The other problem is with your phrase "apparently happens" because human beings have a huge problem with "apparently". It is the weak spot in our cognition and real progress in learning has only been made when we systematically ignore the apparent.
Sorry, I disagree. I don't believe these EVP's are from some other kind of signal.
First, why is it ALWAYS human voices? Why don't they ever record music? Second, while not all EVP's respond to what is going on around them, many of them seem to do so. Today on the radio, one of the investigators fell down some stairs. Right afterwards, they recorded a woman asking, "Are you okay?" Most EVP's are mumbled and garbled and there may be a host of interpretations that you could give to what they are saying. This one, in my mind, was very clear.
Now, mind you, I remain skeptical that these are spirits. I think there is another explanation, but I honestly don't think it is interference. Point being, this is an unexplained phenomenon.
If there's one thing I've learned from this board, it's that consensual sex with multiple partners is okay unless God commands it. - Abman
I find this place to be hostile toward all brands of stupidity. That's why I like it. - Some Schmo
Scottie wrote:Sorry, I disagree. I don't believe these EVP's are from some other kind of signal.
First, why is it ALWAYS human voices? Why don't they ever record music? Second, while not all EVP's respond to what is going on around them, many of them seem to do so. Today on the radio, one of the investigators fell down some stairs. Right afterwards, they recorded a woman asking, "Are you okay?" Most EVP's are mumbled and garbled and there may be a host of interpretations that you could give to what they are saying. This one, in my mind, was very clear.
Now, mind you, I remain skeptical that these are spirits. I think there is another explanation, but I honestly don't think it is interference. Point being, this is an unexplained phenomenon.
Why in the world would paranormal activity only show up on the FM radio?
It is as unexplained as the Virgin Mary appearing in someone's peanut butter sandwich.
John Larsen wrote:Why in the world would paranormal activity only show up on the FM radio?
It is as unexplained as the Virgin Mary appearing in someone's peanut butter sandwich.
FM radio????
Methinks you need to research this a bit more before you attempt to sound like you know what you're talking about.
Whatever. Waves are waves.
Since you seem to know what you are talking about, why don't you tell the class where these special waves are coming from--if not from natural sources?
A brief review of history will show that ascribing unexplained phenomena to the paranormal, although very common, only lasts until the body of science expands. It is a fallacy to suggest that merely because something is unexplained it could be supernatural, first you would have to prove the existence of the supernatural otherwise you are begging the question. Unexplained phenomena does not, in the least, suggest the existence of the paranormal.
It's always in the past, for some reason, that people claim the miracles happened.
In the Old Testament, people had mountains literally move, donkeys speak, prophets called down Godfire and it consumed massive stone altars and a gaggle of "enemy" priests, the world covered with water up to the top of the highest peak, but don't worry, humanity and the animal kingdom were spared by samples of each "kind" being preserved from the flood in a giant wooden boat.
By the time of the New Testament, we have a guy who walked on water, a guy who threw a line into the water and pulled out a fish with the exact amount of his tax bill, in change, in the fish's mouth. A guy took jars of water and converted it to wine, spit into some dirt and made a clay out of it, rubbed it onto a guy's eyes, and he suddenly was cured of blindness. Various other healings stories. A guy spoke with some spirits that inhabited a wild naked guy, and the spirits left him and entered into some pigs, who hated being possessed by demons so much that they all jumped into a lake and drowned themselves.
Even in relatively recent times, Joseph Smith passed a handkerchief around and people who touched it were healed of malaria or dysentery or whatever it was. He found the bones of an ancient Lamanite military hero, the actual altar made by Adam himself after leaving the Garden of Eden (in Missouri), which miraculously had survived the flood and the intervening 6000 years intact. He spoke with angels all the time, and could tell you exactly what the Apostle Paul looked like. He could see buried treasure by looking at a rock in the bottom of his hat, and he could translate golden plates, not present with him in the room, the same way. Egyptian funeral documents took on a whole new meaning due to this guy's God-given gift of miraculous translation.
But nowadays? Mormon Prophets don't reveal anything anymore, in fact, they disclaim so much of what previous Prophets "revealed", that if anything there is a net loss in the amount of "revealed" material in the church today from what there was in the early days. Priesthood blessings are always couched in weasel words (thy will be done), and Mormons still go to the hospital when they break something or come down sick, just like everyone else. No mountains have ever been shown to have moved. No day has ever been shown to have been any longer, or shorter, than that predicted by the position of the Earth in its orbit around the sun. Mormon blessings never result in amputated limbs reappearing, nor really any diseases being cured that might not have cured anyway. We no longer know that the Indians are lamanites, nor the Polynesians, and it turns out the Navajo really didn't turn white when they joined the Mormon church.
It's just too obvious. Miracles are mythological. It's easy enough to point to old books claiming miracles done by the prophets of yore, but the ones we've got today can't do anything at all with this awesome "power of God" priesthood they've got. No translation, no revelation, no answers, no really effective blessings, no walking on water, no moving mountains, no nothing. Nothing but excuses about why we shouldn't expect to actually see any real miracles.
Mormonism ceased being a compelling topic for me when I finally came to terms with its transformation from a personality cult into a combination of a real estate company, a SuperPac, and Westboro Baptist Church. - Kishkumen
Since you seem to know what you are talking about, why don't you tell the class where these special waves are coming from--if not from natural sources?
A brief review of history will show that ascribing unexplained phenomena to the paranormal, although very common, only lasts until the body of science expands. It is a fallacy to suggest that merely because something is unexplained it could be supernatural, first you would have to prove the existence of the supernatural otherwise you are begging the question. Unexplained phenomena does not, in the least, suggest the existence of the paranormal.
True. And, as I said, I don't believe it is paranormal or spirits or whatever. I DO believe there is another explanation. However, I don't know what that is. Which was my point from the beginning. There is a LOOOONG list of unexplained phenomenon which appears to be magic. We can't simply brush these aside with "I'm sure someday we'll debunk it". That is as bad as apologists saying that someday we'll find Zarahemla.
If we don't know the cause, we can't rule out the supernatural. Although unlikely, it IS a possibility.
If there's one thing I've learned from this board, it's that consensual sex with multiple partners is okay unless God commands it. - Abman
I find this place to be hostile toward all brands of stupidity. That's why I like it. - Some Schmo
Sethbag wrote:It's easy enough to point to old books claiming miracles done by the prophets of yore, but the ones we've got today can't do anything at all with this awesome "power of God" priesthood they've got. No translation, no revelation, no answers, no really effective blessings, no walking on water, no moving mountains, no nothing. Nothing but excuses about why we shouldn't expect to actually see any real miracles.
Depressing, isn't it?
(Nevo, Jan 23) And the Melchizedek Priesthood may not have been restored until the summer of 1830, several months after the organization of the Church.
