Apostle Christofferson apparently believes in the Flood...

The catch-all forum for general topics and debates. Minimal moderation. Rated PG to PG-13.
_Ray A

Re: Apostle Christofferson apparently believes in the Flood...

Post by _Ray A »

Wheat wrote:I thought Christofferson's talk was the best one in General Conference.

I agreed with everything he said. And I'm convinced that everything he said was based on truth or will eventually be shown as true.

I love and value science, technology, and intellectual progress of all kinds. But I have a healthy skepticism of science's pretensions to answer all questions. I'm convinced that it is just plain wrong on many things that it trumpets as *proven facts*.


You wouldn't know what skepticism was if it bit you on your ass.
_Ray A

Re: Apostle Christofferson apparently believes in the Flood...

Post by _Ray A »

Wheat wrote: I'm convinced that it is just plain wrong on many things that it trumpets as *proven facts*.


You mean like a "Nephite" seeing 2,500 years into the future? And Christians living the Law of Moses in 600 BC?

Do you wear sandals? I hope so, because you wouldn't have the IQ to tie shoelaces.
>
>
>
_bcspace
_Emeritus
Posts: 18534
Joined: Mon Dec 04, 2006 6:48 pm

Re: Apostle Christofferson apparently believes in the Flood...

Post by _bcspace »

I agree wth bcspace, you can't believe in LDS doctrine as presented in the standard works (esp. moses) if you don't believe in a worldwide flood and the confusion of the languages at the tower of Babel.


That's not what I said. I said one has to believe them to be historical events. I said nothing of the actual details though the standard Christian conception is currently LDS doctrine (in the absence of additional information).
Machina Sublime
Satan's Plan Deconstructed.
Your Best Resource On Joseph Smith's Polygamy.
Conservatism is the Gospel of Christ and the Plan of Salvation in Action.
The Degeneracy Of Progressivism.
_Inconceivable
_Emeritus
Posts: 3405
Joined: Mon Dec 04, 2006 5:44 am

Re: Apostle Christofferson apparently believes in the Flood...

Post by _Inconceivable »

Danna (and Collegeterrace),

Thanks for the humor this morning.

So about the spiders..

In AZ we have Black Widows and Brown Recluse. Australia has some particularly nasty Funnelwebs. I suppose these little pests just hung out in the rafters till the sun came out. Thing is, some spiders don't hang out in rafters.

Not to mention vipers..

Diamondbacks, spitting cobra, coral, cottonmouth..

But the real unspoken miracle of Noah and the Ark is how he and the entire circle of life crammed into God's floating outhouse survived the flood of crap that sloshed to and fro.
_Ray A

Re: Apostle Christofferson apparently believes in the Flood...

Post by _Ray A »

Orson Pratt on Adam in America, and the Ark being built in America:

This Continent was first settled, after the Flood, by a colony from the Tower of Babel, who were a righteous people. They were a people with whom God conversed, and to whom He made Himself manifest in a very wonderful and marvellous manner. How many people lived here before the Flood is not for me to say, as it is not revealed. We may, however, observe, that so far as new revelation has given us information on this subject, this Continent of ours may be ranked among the first lands occupied by the human family. The very first man who had dominion on the face of the earth, under the direction of the Heavens, once dwelt on this Continent. His name was Adam. Whether his first residence was on this land, whether the garden that was planted for his occupation was on this Continent, or some other, is not revealed in any written or printed revelation. But he certainly did, in the course of his lifetime, either from this being his native land, or by emigration, actually come in possession of this part of the globe; and a large settlement was formed, and the righteous who lived before the flood inherited it, and no doubt, left their blessing on the land. It was here where Adam, Seth, Enos, Cainan, Mahalaleel, Jared, Enoch, Methusaleh and Noah dwelt. It was on this land where Noah built his ark, which was blown by the winds of Heaven away to the east, and landed on Ararat. It was here where Enoch preached and published glad tidings of great joy; it was on this land—the American Continent—where he gathered the people from many nations, and built up a city and called it Zion. It was here where the people of God flourished before the flood, and were of one heart and one mind, having an experience of some three hundred and
sixty-five years in order to bring about a sufficient degree of righteousness and faith to be taken away from here and translated to some other region.
It was here where Enoch was clothed upon with the power of God to that degree that he was enabled to publish to the inhabitants of the earth things that were before his day, even from before the foundation of the world, and also to prophecy of things that should transpire from his day down to the end of the world. It was here that he continued his preaching to the inhabitants of the city of Zion until he made them so acquainted with the law of God, and inspired them with such faith that the earth could not contain them. It was by his faith and the faith of his people that the very elements around him felt the power of God; and when he spake the word of the Lord the earth upon which he stood trembled and shook by the power of the Almighty, and the mountains fled from before his presence, and the great rivers of this Continent were turned out of their courses, and all things seemed to feel the power of the Lord. Even a new land came up out of the great deep, and so fearful were the enemies of the people of God, and so great was the terror of the Lord upon them, that they left this country and went forth upon the face of the waters and occupied the land that came up out of the deep. These things are not revealed to us by the Bible, or by tradition, but by the inspiration of the Almighty through that great modern prophet who was raised up to commence this marvellous work of which you and I are now partakers.

A few hundred years after all these things had transpired on this Continent, and Noah and his family, the only survivors of the Flood, had been wafted away to distant lands, and had peopled a portion of Asia, the descendants of Noah undertook to build a great tower that they might make themselves a great name, instead of fulfilling the purposes of the Almighty, in spreading forth, and occupying and subduing the earth.
The Lord was very much displeased with them on that occasion, because of the wickedness that existed in their midst, which was calculated to be strengthened through their unity. Hence He made a decree, according to the old Book—the Bible, that they should not dwell thus, together. He confounded their language, and swore in His wrath that they should be scattered. A portion of the people from that tower came to this Continent. Journal of Discourses, 12:338,339
_Persephone
_Emeritus
Posts: 65
Joined: Mon Aug 18, 2008 6:23 pm

Re: Apostle Christofferson apparently believes in the Flood...

Post by _Persephone »

I don't know any Mormons who don't believe in a universal flood of Noah and the tower of Babel.
_Ray A

Re: Apostle Christofferson apparently believes in the Flood...

Post by _Ray A »

Persephone wrote:I don't know any Mormons who don't believe in a universal flood of Noah and the tower of Babel.


I think are are a few on this board who believe the Limited Flood Theory.
_Persephone
_Emeritus
Posts: 65
Joined: Mon Aug 18, 2008 6:23 pm

Re: Apostle Christofferson apparently believes in the Flood...

Post by _Persephone »

Ray A wrote:
Persephone wrote:I don't know any Mormons who don't believe in a universal flood of Noah and the tower of Babel.


I think are are a few on this board who believe the Limited Flood Theory.

Are these same people pushing for sprinkling to replace immersion as the mode of baptism?

If they're not, then they seem damn inconsistent to me. At least when it comes to Mormon doctrine.
_bcspace
_Emeritus
Posts: 18534
Joined: Mon Dec 04, 2006 6:48 pm

Re: Apostle Christofferson apparently believes in the Flood...

Post by _bcspace »

Orson Pratt on Adam in America, and the Ark being built in America:


Non doctrinal.

I don't know any Mormons who don't believe in a universal flood of Noah and the tower of Babel.

I think are are a few on this board who believe the Limited Flood Theory.


If you change the word "believe" to accept", here I am.
Machina Sublime
Satan's Plan Deconstructed.
Your Best Resource On Joseph Smith's Polygamy.
Conservatism is the Gospel of Christ and the Plan of Salvation in Action.
The Degeneracy Of Progressivism.
_Ray A

Re: Apostle Christofferson apparently believes in the Flood...

Post by _Ray A »

bcspace wrote:
Non doctrinal.



Okay, BC, who in the Church today among the General Authorities "speaks doctrine"? None? D&C 68:

1 My servant, Orson Hyde, was called by his ordination to proclaim the everlasting gospel, by the Spirit of the living God, from people to people, and from land to land, in the congregations of the wicked, in their synagogues, reasoning with and expounding all scriptures unto them.
2 And, behold, and lo, this is an ensample unto all those who were ordained unto this priesthood, whose mission is appointed unto them to go forth—
3 And this is the ensample unto them, that they shall speak as they are moved upon by the Holy Ghost.
4 And whatsoever they shall speak when moved upon by the Holy Ghost shall be scripture, shall be the will of the Lord, shall be the mind of the Lord, shall be the word of the Lord, shall be the voice of the Lord, and the power of God unto salvation.
5 Behold, this is the promise of the Lord unto you, O ye my servants.


But by your reckoning, only written scripture is valid?

Was Orson Pratt a deceiver, deluded???
Post Reply