Will DCP Keep His Promise To BYU?

[Kishkumen]

Kish,

Speaking of making psychological assessments ...

Lame, DocCam. I made a very general statement about the sanity of continuing in this endless attack on DCP. I did not use clinical terminology as you guys did.

Given your avatar, one would think playing nice with an organization designed to destroy reputations, insult believers and nonbelievers alike, and yes, being paid to prop up the cojcolds, is a disastrous policy.

I know you have a point, but I can't detect it in this mess of verbiage.

You're defending a dickhole by tsk taking the board. It's as if 30+ years of DCP's lies, exaggerated claims, attacks, passive aggressivism, insults, broken promises, weekly hit pieces, and fake 'scholarship' never happened for you. You know what would happen if the Mopologists stopped doing that Crap? Things would actually calm down.

Yes, that's how these things work. If only someone else would do the right thing, everything would be OK. Lovely how we can so easily absolve ourselves of responsibility for our own actions by pointing at the shortcomings in others. I think there is a famous Bible saying about that.

Anyway. I take it you believe the kind of resistance you find palatable is a sort of milquetoast response that rises above the DCPs, Midgleys, Gees, ad McGregors of the Mormon world. They're raging assholes and need to be identified as such otherwise brainiacs like the guy in my sign line will continue to think the mopologists are worthy of his respect and are trustworthy scholars.

There was a time that I was very concerned about the role of Mopologetics on BYU campus. I thought it was a very bad situation, and I called it out. I also sometimes went too far and did stupid things as I did it. I recognize I should have done better than I did, although I will credit myself with also trying to be a decent person, failing sometimes, admittedly, and trying to correct myself when I did fail.

Listen, there will always be people who are attracted to nasty apologetic tactics, no matter how self-defeating they are. At the same time, it does us no good to get down in the mud with people who thrive on behaving badly or who get their kicks playing these games. My two cents.

Where it gets really weird, in my opinion, is when it becomes this endless obsession with one person, whose intelligence, honesty, sanity, weight, personal appearance, family, hobbies, trips, anecdotes, indeed, entire life are made the stuff of mean-spirited sport for years on end. It is really gross, in my opinion. I don't expect it will end just because I write about how I find it grotesque, offensive, and beneath the dignity of decent human beings, but I had my say. You know how I feel, and you will do as seems best to you.

[Chap]

Speaking as a nevermo interested in the extent to which religious truth claims may be seen as reasonable, I'll say that when Daniel Peterson used to frequent this board, and was willing to engage in debate without being able to silence his opponents (or have the silencing done for him by biased moderators), I found him an interesting figure.

Nowadays, not so much. However, I don't claim that lack of interest as a sign of superior ethical standards on my part: it's just that from my point of view (as one who has enjoyed debating with aggressive religionists) he has dropped off the menu of possible sources of distraction in life's duller moments.

If, however, I had spent much of my life in the CoJCoLDS, and finally, like many posters here, exited it at some considerable personal cost, including cost in terms of my family, social and business relationships, as well as a sense of having been personally deceived and swindled financially, I think I would feel differently about DCP in his capacity as a long-term, aggressive and not very scrupulous defender of 'the Church'.

So I don't think I would want criticise such people much if they don't feel inclined to cut DCP any slack.

[Doctor CamNC4Me]

There was a time that I was very concerned about the role of Mopologetics on BYU campus. I thought it was a very bad situation, and I called it out. I also sometimes went too far and did stupid things as I did it. I recognize I should have done better than I did, although I will credit myself with also trying to be a decent person, failing sometimes, admittedly, and trying to correct myself when I did fail.

Listen, there will always be people who are attracted to nasty apologetic tactics, no matter how self-defeating they are. At the same time, it does us no good to get down in the mud with people who thrive on behaving badly or who get their kicks playing these games. My two cents.

Where it gets really weird, in my opinion, is when it becomes this endless obsession with one person, whose intelligence, honesty, sanity, weight, personal appearance, family, hobbies, trips, anecdotes, indeed, entire life are made the stuff of mean-spirited sport for years on end. It is really gross, in my opinion. I don't expect it will end just because I write about how I find it grotesque, offensive, and beneath the dignity of decent human beings, but I had my say. You know how I feel, and you will do as seems best to you.

I'm sorry, was there a point in that mish mash of words, bad thinking, and opaque reasoning? Do a better job of writing. Thanks.

That said, it appears to me you've taken some of these DCP threads personally. Try not to make his shortcomings your own. If you're not published, us noting his lying to his employer and taking money without producing an agreed upon product isn't your professional cross to bear.

- Doc

[DrW]

Surely you saw DCP's response posted upthread stating that he acknowledges the opinion on his behaviors. DCP even indicated that he agrees he might be exhibiting behavioral symptoms of NPD. He wryly (and quite appropriately) asked that, if he were a narcissist, how would he know?

Don't be disingenuous, DrW. For Pete's sake.

Far from being disingenuous, I was commenting on DCP's occasional wry sense of humor and his expression of self-awareness. If you had any sense of subtext, Kish, you would have recognized the praise, faint as it may have been.

And for what it's worth, given his acknowledgement above, I accept that "it is what it is" with DCP and do not intend to bring up any of his bad behavior, born of his narcissism, on this board again. As DCP himself appeared to acknowledge, he just can't help himself. Such is NPD.

[Kishkumen]

If, however, I had spent much of my life in the CoJCoLDS, and finally, like many posters here, exited it at some considerable personal cost, including cost in terms of my family, social and business relationships, as well as a sense of having been personally deceived and swindled financially, I think I would feel differently about DCP in his capacity as a long-term, aggressive and not very scrupulous defender of 'the Church'.

So I don't think I would want criticise such people much if they don't feel inclined to cut DCP any slack.

OK. Thanks for sharing that, Chap. On the other hand, perhaps it might be worth the effort to suggest that attacking DCP personally year after year is a poor substitute for moving on from the LDS Church in a positive way. I don't think that not "feel[ing] inclined to cut DCP any slack" is exactly what we are talking about here. Surely there are many people who don't cut him *any* slack but then don't attend to that task for a decade or more.

As people comment on DCP's alleged mental health issues, it is reasonable to note that those who have spent years attacking DCP personally aren't exactly making a credible case from a position of exhibiting model mental/emotional health.

[Kishkumen]

Far from being disingenuous, I was commenting on DCP's occasional wry sense of humor and his expression of self-awareness. If you had any sense of subtext, Kish, you would have recognized the praise, faint as it may have been.

And for what it's worth, given his acknowledgement above, I accept that "it is what it is" with DCP and do not intend to bring up any of his bad behavior, born of his narcissism, on this board again. As DCP himself acknowledged, he just can't help himself. Such is NPD.

Keep on digging!

[DrW]

Keep on digging!

Cute.
Is that the best you've got?

[Kishkumen]

I'm sorry . . .

Indeed.

That said, it appears to me you've taken some of these DCP threads personally. Try not to make his shortcomings your own. If you're not published, us noting his lying to his employer and taking money without producing an agreed upon product isn't your professional cross to bear.

Excellent example of deflection, DocCam. You don't like being called out for your bad behavior, so you attack others. One wonders what you may be compensating for in this years-long disparagement of DCP. I really don't want to know. Thanks in advance for not sharing.

[Kishkumen]

Cute.
Is that the best you've got?

LOL. I love how long it took you to come up with that extra comeback.

Fail.

[Chap]

If, however, I had spent much of my life in the CoJCoLDS, and finally, like many posters here, exited it at some considerable personal cost, including cost in terms of my family, social and business relationships, as well as a sense of having been personally deceived and swindled financially, I think I would feel differently about DCP in his capacity as a long-term, aggressive and not very scrupulous defender of 'the Church'.

So I don't think I would want criticise such people much if they don't feel inclined to cut DCP any slack.

OK. Thanks for sharing that, Chap. On the other hand, perhaps it might be worth the effort to suggest that attacking DCP personally year after year is a poor substitute for moving on from the LDS Church in a positive way. I don't think that not "feel[ing] inclined to cut DCP any slack" is not exactly what we are talking about here. Surely there are many people who don't cut him *any* slack but then don't attend to that task for a decade or more.

As people comment on DCP's alleged mental health issues, it is reasonable to note that those who have spent years attacking DCP personally aren't exactly making a credible case from a position of exhibiting model mental/emotional health.

This board exists for the purpose of discussing Mormonism. It is reasonable to see Mormon apologetics a major part of that topic, and DCP has been and continues to be a major figure in that enterprise. There are indeed many people who once posted here but no longer do so: perhaps we may surmise that they have, in your sense "mov[ed] on from the LDS Church in a positive way."

In any case, for those who do continue to post here (as you and I both do) to abstain scrupulously from any further criticism of DCP is not, I think essential to our receiving a positive assessment of our mental or emotional well-being. DrW, for instance, seems pretty happy in himself, as do a number of others.