Informing non-members about Mormonism- suggestions

[_Jason Bourne]

Over 270,000 joined last year. Are you suggesting they are all blighted idiots?

If you could draw up a distribution curve of Mormon Missionary contacts with people, and the percentage of those contacts that lead to convert baptisms, I think you'd find that only a very small fringe of people contacted by the missionaries are ever baptised. [/quote]

Sure I agree. I never postulated otherwise. It is a very small % based on contact.

Then when you consider the large fraction (I've heard it mentioned as a large majority) of these "convert" baptisms are people who are inactive in the church before their first year is out, and sometimes within days or weeks. We're talking about a very, very small percentage of people contacted by the missionaries who ever become baptised.

In my ward and stake we keep about 50%. At times it has been higher. I think worldwide it is about 30% or so.

In my mission, be far most of the baptisms were of single, poor, relatively uneducated immigrants, and the educated, Swiss or German native, families were like a once or twice a year occurrence mission-wide.

When I served in the states in from 79-81 it was mixed. I baptized some very well off and educated folks and some very poor and uneducated as well.

Today, my experience for those joining in my ward and stake is it is more lower economic class and uneducated at least where I live though once in a while. When I was a bishop we used to joke when we heard of a new investigator and ask "Do they have a car and a job?"

Are you going to disagree with me here? Do you really believe those 270,000 converts represent long-time MADB lurkers who took it all in and decided, on balance, that Joseph Smith really was commanded of God in all these things he did, and that they'd better join up?

No but I never claimed they were all MADB lurker types. Just that they were not all blighted idiots. They are a mixed bag.

[_Roger Morrison]

Re my mother being excluded from three grandaughter's weddings: Thanks for your empathy. I know I'm one of many who have endured such unfounded discrimination, as Jason and others express. But, "by their fruits are they known."

Anyyyyyyway, 270,000 baptisms world wide by 50,000 +/- Missionaries?? Can any one crunch the numbers and arrive at an-hours-per Convert, then a dollar-cost-per Convert? Sort of a cost-benefit thing.

I don't have a calculator with me. By pencil & paper I get 156,000,000 Missionary-hours-year >>>>> 270,000 = 580 hours-baptism X $10.00 (arbitrary) per hour = $5800.00
30% retention ????

Maybe, cost of 50,000 Missionaries in the field worked into the equation would be more practical/revealing???

Interesting number. Is there a country break-down?

Roger

[_antishock8]

Over 270,000 joined last year. Are you suggesting they are all blighted idiots?

Umm... Yeah? Deduct "children of record", first. Then let's do the math.

In my mission I baptized 53 people. Half of which were children (below the age of 12), either from inactive Mormon families or from families that just couldn't say no to our persistence. Of the remaining 21 people half were adult family members (12 years and older) of inactive Mormons. Of the 11 "normal" people I baptized half truly didn't have the heart to tell us "no". Of the 5 "legitimate" baptims maybe, MAYBE, three were active members post-baptism. All in all, from what I could gather, by the time I left the mission field a handful of baptisms, children included, were still going to church. So, about 4-6 people, out of 53, would go to church about once a month.

The bottom line, and again, I don't know why one feels the need to present Mormonism in propaganda terms (270,000!), is that the vast majority of Mormon baptism are not true converts. The "backbone" of Mormon growth is internal growth through birthrates, and acculturation of said births.

[_Jason Bourne]

Umm... Yeah? Deduct "children of record", first. Then let's do the math.

Yeah...I did. 270k is the convert. Children of record baptisms were about 90,000.

The bottom line, and again, I don't know why one feels the need to present Mormonism in propaganda terms (270,000!), is that the vast majority of Mormon baptism are not true converts. The "backbone" of Mormon growth is internal growth through birthrates, and acculturation of said births.

I presented no propaganda. 270k is the convert baptisms as the Church defines them. Some may be from less active homes. We just had one of those last week. The girl was 12 and be definition a convert baptism. Many are just regular convert baptisms.

[_ludwigm]

There was a joke about three types of lying:
1. Telling a lie
2. Hiding the truth
3. Making a statistic.

The numbers can be weird.

Since I became a less active (beautiful euphemism for inactive) investigator, I take part only in speshul events. (Conferences, feasts, sundays with more than two of our grandchildren etc)

Last time there was the christmas supper at saturday. Two dozen dish, really a big table. The lineup before was twenty minute, including the opening and closing prayer and song, really the worst of the feasts I ever take part.

The headcount was 46-48 (there were some kids who circulated with speed made them uncountable).

As far as I knew it before, the ward size is about 150-180. Anyway, I have asked my wife about it. She said she didn't know but the women only were more than two hundred.


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What do You think, how many of that mentioned 270000 will be there after one year? The church should open that type of books, too.

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here comes some stupid ad

[_Jason Bourne]

What do You think, how many of that mentioned 270000 will be there after one year? The church should open that type of books, too.

Worldwide retention is about 30%.

[_antishock8]

Any idea what the "activity" rate is? Let's say being an active Mormon is a once-a-month attendance rate.

[_Jason Bourne]

Any idea what the "activity" rate is? Let's say being an active Mormon is a once-a-month attendance rate.

In the US it runs about 48%-52%. The rest of the world about 25% to 30%.

[_antishock8]

Any idea what the "activity" rate is? Let's say being an active Mormon is a once-a-month attendance rate.

In the US it runs about 48%-52%. The rest of the world about 25% to 30%.

Do you have a source for those figures, by chance?

[_TAK]

Do you have a source for those figures, by chance?

Jason may be thinking this:

The Encyclopedia of Mormonism notes: "Attendance at sacrament meeting varies substantially. Canada, the South Pacific, and the United States average between 40 percent and 50 percent. Europe and Africa average about 35 percent. Asia and Latin America have weekly attendance rates of about 25 percent."[50] By multiplying the number of members in each region by the regional activity rate and summating the data, one comes up with a worldwide LDS activity rate of 35 percent, or approximately 4 million individuals. An Associated Press article observed: "While the church doesn't release statistics on church activity rates, some research suggests participation in the church is as low as 30 percent."


Some interesting stuff:

http://www.cumorah.com/index.php?target ... apter_id=7