"I Hate This Board"

The catch-all forum for general topics and debates. Minimal moderation. Rated PG to PG-13.
Post Reply
_Inconceivable
_Emeritus
Posts: 3405
Joined: Mon Dec 04, 2006 5:44 am

Re: "I Hate This Board"

Post by _Inconceivable »

Daniel Peterson wrote:I love it when people who post on this board think the fact that others post on this board discredits those others. They're probably right, of course. Posting here is neither a virtue nor a worthwhile accomplishment.

Back at ya Dan.

From your pandemic of condescending posts I would observe you likely consider yourself a dime in a handfull of pennies here.

Keep doing what you're doing. It works for everyone.
_TAK
_Emeritus
Posts: 1555
Joined: Thu Feb 08, 2007 4:47 pm

Re: "I Hate This Board"

Post by _TAK »

Daniel Peterson wrote:I can't recall ever having used such a quotation in a fireside .. and I think I can confidently say that I have never, ever, generalized from one of them to any kind of universal statement about "what a typical ex-Mormon is like."


Really ?? This sound familiar:

Reflections on Secular Anti-Mormonism
A Message Board Jam-Packed with Angry Apostates

I will pass over very quickly a message board that I like to monitor that is, in its way, a kind of wildlife preserve for secular anti-Mormons. Some of you are probably familiar with it. Although it is of unquestionable sociological and psychological interest, it offers little if anything of intellectual merit. What was once said of William Jennings Bryan could be said of even many of the star posters on this message board: "One could steer a schooner through any part of his argument and never scrape against a fact." Several, even, of the posters with the greatest intellectual pretensions on the board have consistently demonstrated themselves incapable of accurately summarizing Latter-day Saint positions and arguments, let alone of genuinely engaging them. It's hard not to think in this context of Groucho Marx: "From the moment I picked up your book until I laid it down," Groucho wrote to the novelist Sydney Perelman, "I was convulsed with laughter. Someday I intend to read it." Many on this particular message board seem to be of the same mentality as the academic who was asked whether he had read the new book by Professor Jones. "Read it?" he replied. "Why, I haven't even reviewed it yet!"

What the board does offer are displays of bravado, strutting, believers' arguments completely misunderstood and misrepresented, bold challenges hurled out to those who are barred from responding, and guffaws of triumph over enemies who are not permitted to reply. Dissent is rigidly excluded from this board, even as its denizens criticize the Church for its supposed "repressiveness." However, notwithstanding the rigorous exclusion of all troublesome dissent from their domain, the faith these posters have in their own unanswerably brilliant selves is oddly refreshing to see in atheists, whom you wouldn't expect to believe in any God at all.

Voltaire once explained that "My prayer to God is a very short one: 'Oh, Lord, make my enemies ridiculous.' God," he said, "has granted it."

But this doesn't exhaust the pleasures of that message board. It is rife with personal abuse and bloodcurdling hostility, not uncommonly obscene, directed against people they don't know and haven't even met--against President Hinckley, Joseph Smith, the Brethren, the general membership of the Church, and even, somewhat obsessively, against one particular rather insignificant BYU professor. Ordinary members of the Church--Morgbots or Morons or Sheeple, in the jargon of the board--are routinely stereotyped as insane, tyrannical, cheap, bigoted, ill-mannered, irrational, sexually repressed, stupid, greedy, foolish, rude, poor tippers, sick, brain-dead, and uncultured. There was once even a thread--and I'm not making this up--devoted to discussing how Mormons noisily slurp their soup in restaurants. Posts frequently lament the stupidity and gullibility of Church leaders, neighbors, parents, spouses, siblings, and even offspring--who may be wholly unaware of the anonymous poster's secret double life of contemptuous disbelief. It is a splendid cyber illustration of the finger pointing and mocking found in the "great and spacious building" of 1 Nephi. Whenever the poisonous culture of the place is criticized, however, its defenders take refuge in the culture of victimhood, deploying a supposed need for therapeutic self-expression as their all-encompassing excuse.

Contemplating a depressing number of the posters on that board, I've thought to myself, "If this is what liberation from the Mormon 'myth' makes you--a vulgar and sometimes duplicitous crank, cackling with malice and spite--then I would prefer to spend the few brief years left to me (before I dissolve into the irreversible and never-ending oblivion many of the board's posters prophesy for me and all humankind) with people who haven't been liberated. I think of the apostates of Ammonihah, mocking Alma and Amulek in prison, "gnashing their teeth upon them, and spitting upon them, and saying: How shall we look when we are damned?"1 Surely the damned will not look much different than this.

But I'm troubled by the capacity even of far less malevolent message boards to supply a supportive sort of ersatz community as an alternative to the fellowship of the Saints, and I worry about what participation on even relatively benign boards does to some Latter-day Saint souls. I have in mind one frequent poster in particular, who claims simply to be doubting and troubled, but who in fact never misses an opportunity for a snide remark about his Church, in which he remains active, and its teachings. These teachings involve weighty matters of utmost import. Millions have placed their hopes in the gospel's message, and, if this were false, it would be tragic and unutterably sad. Perhaps the cynicism that this poster and many others cultivate is no more than a psychologically understandable defensive shell, a self-protective whistling past the graveyard of doubt. But, even so, it is a shell that will, I fear, block the Spirit. I am not optimistic about his long-term prospects, barring a fundamental shift in attitude (and, even less hopefully, perhaps in personality).

Characteristic of much secularizing anti-Mormon participation on the Web is a corrosive cynicism that, in my experience, will erode anything with which it comes in contact. It is not so much a reasoned intellectual stance as an attitude, or even, perhaps, a personality type.
God has the right to create and to destroy, to make like and to kill. He can delegate this authority if he wishes to. I know that can be scary. Deal with it.
Nehor.. Nov 08, 2010


_________________
_Inconceivable
_Emeritus
Posts: 3405
Joined: Mon Dec 04, 2006 5:44 am

Re: "I Hate This Board"

Post by _Inconceivable »

Stellar, TAK.

Hey, Dan,

I can't think of a more discriptive quote that could make your little fig leaf any more transparent.
_Jersey Girl
_Emeritus
Posts: 34407
Joined: Wed Oct 25, 2006 1:16 am

Re: "I Hate This Board"

Post by _Jersey Girl »

Daniel Peterson wrote:And I know something about what's coming.


So do I.

I can wait. I can even enjoy waiting.


Me too.
Failure is not falling down but refusing to get up.
Chinese Proverb
_Some Schmo
_Emeritus
Posts: 15602
Joined: Tue Mar 27, 2007 2:59 pm

Re: "I Hate This Board"

Post by _Some Schmo »

Daniel Peterson wrote: Another reason: I've explained for years, though few seem to take me seriously, that I'm fascinated by the egregrious incivility and bad behavior in which -- though it's not limited to them -- a significant proportion of apostates and anti-Mormons indulge. I really do find it mesmerizing to observe.

I do believe you're fascinated by this, so much so that you engage in it regularly yourself. It appears you like to knock the crap out of a beehive because you're fascinated by angry bees. I imagine it's also no surprise to you that people are fascinated by your egregrious[sic] incivility and bad behavior as well, which is why you get the attention you seem to crave.

I'm not sure why you'd be particularly fascinated by egregious incivility and bad behavior among "a significant proportion of apostates and anti-Mormons" unless you yourself are an apostate or anti-mormon. (Perhaps you were just alluding to yourself when you said, "though it's not limited to them.") What so great about their brand of bad behavior over anyone else's, such as your own, for instance?
God belief is for people who don't want to live life on the universe's terms.
_Nevo
_Emeritus
Posts: 1500
Joined: Sat Feb 24, 2007 4:05 pm

Re: "I Hate This Board"

Post by _Nevo »

Jersey wrote:As I mentioned on another thread, I couldn't be more satisfied with the pinned thread about the Stanford Book of Mormon authorship study. I'm completely impressed (words fail me) by the contributions of Danna, Byron, Dale and Alma there. I look in on it every day and there's an enormous amount of talent, working cooperatively through a variety of issues and related topics. The dynamics between the posters on that thread are what I feel constitutes authentic discussion and those dynamics are in such short supply on this board.

Really? A bunch of like-minded posters advancing eccentric and implausible theories is the acme of "authentic discussion"? Why, even MAD has those!
_Jersey Girl
_Emeritus
Posts: 34407
Joined: Wed Oct 25, 2006 1:16 am

Re: "I Hate This Board"

Post by _Jersey Girl »

Nevo wrote:
Jersey wrote:As I mentioned on another thread, I couldn't be more satisfied with the pinned thread about the Stanford Book of Mormon authorship study. I'm completely impressed (words fail me) by the contributions of Danna, Byron, Dale and Alma there. I look in on it every day and there's an enormous amount of talent, working cooperatively through a variety of issues and related topics. The dynamics between the posters on that thread are what I feel constitutes authentic discussion and those dynamics are in such short supply on this board.

Really? A bunch of like-minded posters advancing eccentric and implausible theories is the acme of "authentic discussion"? Why, even MAD has those!


The posters that I listed are not completely like-minded nor are they one in purpose, Nevo. They each bring specific talents, perspectives and material to the table.

Having said that, I cannot think of a single instance in 9 years or so that I've known you online that I chose to make light of or mock any post of yours.

But you feel free.
Failure is not falling down but refusing to get up.
Chinese Proverb
_Dr. Shades
_Emeritus
Posts: 14117
Joined: Mon Oct 23, 2006 9:07 pm

Re: "I Hate This Board"

Post by _Dr. Shades »

Nevo wrote:Really? A bunch of like-minded posters advancing eccentric and implausible theories is the acme of "authentic discussion"? Why, even MAD has those!

Which parts of that thread do you consider "eccentric" and "implausible," and why?
"Finally, for your rather strange idea that miracles are somehow linked to the amount of gay sexual gratification that is taking place would require that primitive Christianity was launched by gay sex, would it not?"

--Louis Midgley
_AlmaBound
_Emeritus
Posts: 494
Joined: Sat Dec 27, 2008 9:19 pm

Re: "I Hate This Board"

Post by _AlmaBound »

Dr. Shades wrote:
Nevo wrote:Really? A bunch of like-minded posters advancing eccentric and implausible theories is the acme of "authentic discussion"? Why, even MAD has those!

Which parts of that thread do you consider "eccentric" and "implausible," and why?


I'd like to know, also. Otherwise, this might be my cue.
_Daniel Peterson
_Emeritus
Posts: 7173
Joined: Thu Jul 05, 2007 6:56 pm

Re: "I Hate This Board"

Post by _Daniel Peterson »

TAK wrote:Really ?? This sound familiar:

It does.

And conspicuously absent from it is any declaration that the denizens of the so-called "Recovery" board exemplify "what a typical ex-Mormon is like," or even the slightest hint that secularizing anti-Mormon is a synonym for typical ex-Mormon.

Nice try, though. It showed real initiative.

Some Schmo wrote:people are fascinated by your egregious incivility and bad behavior

Yes, I suppose my egregious incivility and bad behavior must pain a sensitive soul like yours considerably. I apologize for all the suffering I've caused you.

Some Schmo wrote:I'm not sure why you'd be particularly fascinated by egregious incivility and bad behavior among "a significant proportion of apostates and anti-Mormons" unless you yourself are an apostate or anti-mormon.

That makes sense. Ornithologists must be birds. Coin collectors must surely be minted metallic tokens for exchange. No student of Chinese history is non-Chinese.
Post Reply