truth dancer wrote:OK so Inc.... if you don't get any answers it is because God is testing you. If you are left on your own without God, it is because he expects you to work with what you have. If you don't get any response it is because you need time to grow.
And, if you get a wrong answer it is because you haven't figured out how to distinguish between Satan, God, and yourself.
Pretty much takes care of it. ~td~
Testing.
It another way of explaining away this Mormon God's lack of power, authority, capacity, unconditional love and empathy.
Inconceivable wrote: Smith and Young didn't understand their own book.
Perhaps because Joseph knew most of it came from Sidney and others, and very little of it was actually his? So they never really read it, studied it? Joseph was so focused on building out from it (starting the church, coming up with revelations, living on other people's labor) that he wasn't interested in actually reading what they'd created, since he knew it's provence, knew it wasn't what they were telling other people it was?
I wonder if he's still laughing.
(Nevo, Jan 23) And the Melchizedek Priesthood may not have been restored until the summer of 1830, several months after the organization of the Church.
Hi GAZ, nice to see You back! Sorry I'm late in... As to your question: First, the pic of Joseph Smith sure has evolved from what it once was! Hollywood or what, eh? Deception;-0??? Second, the subjectivity of the lesson title starts off far from the objective and intelligent approach to discussion that you felt MUST preceed honest discussion. Do you know what I'm saying, Bro?
To interview "Apostates" sound as if you were planning to interview rapists or child molestors...who too are bizzar social specimens. Which I guess is to be expected from an Authoritarian Elitist Group representitive...
Do You consider those who have chosen to leave Mormonism to have jeopardized ANYTHING in so doing? Are they somehow stigmatized and less worthy of "God's" blessings?
As for me, I devoted myself to Mormonism because it served me well when, and while I needed it... As those needs were filled it was no longer necessary--or needful--to remain as involved.
I consider myself to have graduated from Mormonism with a better understanding of myself, religion in all of its aspects, my relationship with the Universe/"God" & humanity...
I am not bitter, I am better. As I think many might be by their LDS experience... In the least, they know more about Mormonism than they did before their entry. That in itself is knowledge that should serve them well. It has me... Roger... * *
Have you noticed what a beautiful day it is? Some can't... "God": nick-name for the Universe...
Inconceivable wrote: Smith and Young didn't understand their own book.
Perhaps because Joseph knew most of it came from Sidney and others, and very little of it was actually his? So they never really read it, studied it? Joseph was so focused on building out from it (starting the church, coming up with revelations, living on other people's labor) that he wasn't interested in actually reading what they'd created, since he knew it's provence, knew it wasn't what they were telling other people it was?
I wonder if he's still laughing.
And this is why the books (D&C and Book of Mormon for example) are so contradictory to each other and makes it not so simple a doctrine as Gaz thinks. It is a mass of confusion.
I think it would be morally right to lie about your religion to edit the article favorably. bcspace
Do you think it is the responsibility for Muslims to remain true to their covenants/promises/rules/contracts? How about the FLDS? How about Scientologists? Catholics? How about the KKK or Mafia?
It is nonsense to even suggest people be true to anything they find harmful, cruel, inappropriate, illegal, dangerous, wrong, nonsensical, or disgraceful.
Your right. There is no such thing as truth.
What is reality is that That all matter is simply energy condensed and slowed to a low vibration. That we are all one consciousness experiencing itself and there is no death. That life is only an illusion created in the imagination of ourselves.
Phew, I feel so much better. Think I'll go sit on a Ley line and rub a crystal now. Maybe work on my murmer till I get that sound of the universe thing down.
We can easily forgive a child who is afraid of the dark; the real tragedy of life is when men are afraid of the light. - Plato
Something your forgeting. Priesthood does not bless a person unless they use it in service to others.
Service teaches charity. Charity leads to love.
This is accomplished through making time for family home evening and serving your family. Making time for Home Teaching and serving the church members. Making time to bear a meaningful testimony to friends outside the church and serving your fellow man.
Everything about the church encourages love. Some peopel catch on to that, others don't. Attitude and personality play a big part on an individual basis. The siege mentality some people develop does not help this I'm afraid.
We can easily forgive a child who is afraid of the dark; the real tragedy of life is when men are afraid of the light. - Plato
To interview "Apostates" sound as if you were planning to interview rapists or child molestors...who too are bizzar social specimens. Which I guess is to be expected from an Authoritarian Elitist Group representitive...
Do You consider those who have chosen to leave Mormonism to have jeopardized ANYTHING in so doing? Are they somehow stigmatized and less worthy of "God's" blessings?
No, I don't view apostates as freaks. I just wanted to offer a first hand account to the class, and to make these peopel more real to the class as opposed to just characters in a book.
God is a God of covenants Roger. Those who keep his commandments will receive the blessings appointed to them, those who do not have no promise.
We can easily forgive a child who is afraid of the dark; the real tragedy of life is when men are afraid of the light. - Plato
Something your forgeting. Priesthood does not bless a person unless they use it in service to others.
Service teaches charity. Charity leads to love..
..Everything about the church encourages love.
22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? 23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.
(New Testament | Matthew 7:22 - 23)
If you believe in this stuff perhaps you ought to consider devalueing what Bruce R. McConkie pontificated upon the subject and develop a relationship with Christ. Acting in the Mormon God's name does not make one a God or like a God. However, a desire for structure, a sense of duty and going through the mechanics can potentially make a monkey's uncle.
Women are banned from "holding" the priesthood and yet they can develop charity. Charity transcends the bounds of structured religeon and even cultures. Honestly, priesthood power may not be the goofproof catalyst to developing charity that you suppose it is.
Consider this:
48 Wherefore, my beloved brethren, pray unto the Father with all the energy of heart, that ye may be filled with this love, which he hath bestowed upon all who are true followers of his Son, Jesus Christ; that ye may become the sons of God; that when he shall appear we shall be like him, for we shall see him as he is; that we may have this hope; that we may be purified even as he is pure. (Book of Mormon | Moroni 7:48)
You're tossing around a lot of platitudes but what is it you really understand?
GAZ, thanks for your response. You said, (I'm in this:
[quote][No, I don't view apostates as freaks. I just wanted to offer a first hand account to the class, and to make these peopel more real to the class as opposed to just characters in a book. You might not, but the use of that term in LDSism strongly implies negative conotations to anyone who disagrees with LDS leadership. One of the characteristics of Cultish Groups--to disparage those who discent... That that term is picked up thoughtlessly by members does not illustate the high level of nobility that you profess to desire... (And failed to demonstrate by your tasteless mocking of TD.) How did your "Lesson" go? What was the "Lesson Objective?" Was it helped by your research?
God is a God of covenants Roger. Those who keep his commandments will receive the blessings appointed to them, those who do not have no promise.
We might be closer to agreement here than you think, Gaz. "God"--the Universe-- IS a place ("God") of Natural-order. Those who seek, find & follow that order, will receive the reward of their quest. "God" cannot withold from those who find, or "God" would cease to be a "God" of order. But would instead be a favouring "God" of confusion, in which there would, as you say, "...(be) no promise" of unprejudiced order... An order which we have learned to trust, have faith in and depend upon for life's sustenance and advancement...
/quote]
Gaz, you seem to be a well intended young man. Coming to my mind as I was reading, R.M. Enroth's "Churches That Abuse". On page 81 RME quotes Pastor Phil Aguilar of "Set Free Christian Fellowship"... "You need to trust God through me; I know what is best for you."
How many times you (and LDS Leaders) have implied that very thing, over the years, I can't count. In this very thread I think you suggested the person who opened this topic would ignore your counsel at risk of their eternal destiny...
And, I suppose you could rejoinder me in kind ;-)
The above book, by the way, indicates there are, & have been, many worse churches than the M-Church. But the similarities are glaring. They, with LDSism, share Elitism, Authoritainism and intollerance of critical/progressive thinking/expression. The book, an interesting & easy read, is probably available through Abe Books very reasonably priced... Warm regards, Roger * *
Have you noticed what a beautiful day it is? Some can't... "God": nick-name for the Universe...
