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[_Yoda]

You will find that there are a few of us, who are members here, such as Jason, Harmony, Moksha, and myself, who do get frustrated with the more hard-line attitudes.

If I thought it would help, I would lecture Nehor on being more charitable, rather than throwing out phrases such as "Bye", or "don't let the door hit you on the way out", etc.

Nehor, however, is young, and really isn't interested in learning anything, or changing his attitudes. Like most young people, he has it all figured out.

See, Liz knew where I was going.

I'm not really young. I just turned 30 today (physically), 25 (spiritually), 20 (mentally), and 10 (emotionally). A good day.

Happy birthday, Nehor!

And, yes, you are young. I'm old enough to be your.........older sister.

[_The Nehor]

Happy birthday, Nehor!

And, yes, you are young. I'm old enough to be your.........older sister.

Only if Mom really, really wanted a boy and kept trying.

[_Jason Bourne]

In religion on the outside of Mormonism it is perfectly acceptable to move from one congregation of one's own choosing to another congregation of one's own choosing or even to switch denominations and still be welcomed into full fellowship (with a few exceptions re specific denominations and a question of baptism if that comes up). The moving around is entirely within one's own choice. The differences, and some adjustments, may show up if one wishes to make a big switch and then join (eg, from Catholic to Protestant, vice versa). There are many valid reasons for moving from one congregation to another and even crossing the denom line. The key is for the various churches to genuinely welcome newcomers and sincerely wish leavetakers the best in life.

This may be true when hopping from one protestant sect to another. It was not always so.

It may be less true for a Catholics that goes Protestant or visa verse and it is not true for a protestant that becomes Mormon.

But I now see you noted that above.

[_Ray A]

Happy birthday, Nehor!

And, yes, you are young. I'm old enough to be your.........older sister.

My eldest son turns 30 on Saturday (Feb.21st).

I must be an old fogie.

[_John Larsen]

With all due respect, I don't see how you can find animism to be a superior world view to Mormonism. It would seem that any criticism you levy against the Church can be turned right around to your new belief system.

As for altered states, those are easy to produce with the right chemicals, but I don't think you have established that they lead to truth or enlightenment.

[Anonymous]

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[_John Larsen]

With all due respect, I don't see how you can find animism to be a superior world view to Mormonism. It would seem that any criticism you levy against the Church can be turned right around to your new belief system.

As for altered states, those are easy to produce with the right chemicals, but I don't think you have established that they lead to truth or enlightenment.

Ah, you are begining to think about this, good. True, animism is not superior. What it is, is similar. Both are forms of mythology. The myth is created be the experiencer in animism. In mormonsim it is created by the institution. When one experiences or even just witnesses the process of the formation of myth, then it is easier to see how the myth could take institutional form under the right conditions. This is what I mean by it leads to truth. It leads to the root of mythology, and the source from where institutional religions get their stories and teachings.

It helps one understand the process of the formation of religion, and therefore, one is better able to judge the quality of a religions claims.

I am agnostic at this point, however, I am also a theist. I just don't claim knowledge about a creator that I do not have. I do not lie in order to look like I have a "testimony" and therefore achieve some kind of social standing.

What I do is live a moral life to the best of my ability and seek understanding of reality, physical and spiritual.

As for altering brain chemicals to achieve enlightenment, it depends on ones definition of enlightenment. Again, if one believes enlightenment to be a real objective thing, then perhaps it does perhaps it doesn't, there is no way to prove it either way. However, if you are talking about what others experience and call enlightenment, then yes, altering brain chemistry can do this. It has been proven through scientific studies that altered states of consciousness produce experiences indistinguishable from mystical enlightenment experiences recorded throughout history.

Start doing some research in this area and you will be quite amazed. For starters check out John Hopkins study on psilocybin http://www.hopkinsmedicine.org/Press_re ... 11_06.html

Rick Strassman: http://www.rickstrassman.com/

He has found that DMT can produce mystical experiences, including out of body experiences, as well as strange alien abduction experiences, in a labratory setting.

Another interesting book is experiential, called Peopled Darkness, about Salvia Divinorum, how it can allow one to leave their body and travel to the land of the dead.

http://www.amazon.com/Peopled-Darkness- ... 891&sr=8-1

Whether this literally happens is irrelevant, the point is, these are the kinds of experiences religions are based on.

Mormonism wasn't created by the institution, it was co-opted by the institution.

I see no compeling reason to follow any of the links you have given. Frankly it sounds like a lot of nonsense. But if it works for you, great.

[_Gazelam]

I smell a Troll

[_bcspace]

Ah, you must be a member of the church then? Let me ask, do you consider yourself and honest person? If so, how do you reconcile these things?

What's to reconcile? You listed some things, but no specifics anyone could latch on to.

[Anonymous]

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