Runtu wrote:. And also Chesney's children were active members and strongly opposed his leaving the church.
Did he tell them why? And have they cut him off as head of the extended family, now that he's not a member? Please tell me they are not behaving like I expect them to...
(Yes, I do have inside information, and, no, I'm not going to reveal my source. Feel free to consider me a lying apostate as you wish.)
I don't want you to reveal your source. I want you to answer my questions in my post at the top of Page 3, if possible. Thanks.
(Nevo, Jan 23) And the Melchizedek Priesthood may not have been restored until the summer of 1830, several months after the organization of the Church.
Runtu wrote:. And also Chesney's children were active members and strongly opposed his leaving the church.
Did he tell them why? And have they cut him off as head of the extended family, now that he's not a member? Please tell me they are not behaving like I expect them to...
(Yes, I do have inside information, and, no, I'm not going to reveal my source. Feel free to consider me a lying apostate as you wish.)
I don't want you to reveal your source. I want you to answer my questions in my post at the top of Page 3, if possible. Thanks.
(Nevo, Jan 23) And the Melchizedek Priesthood may not have been restored until the summer of 1830, several months after the organization of the Church.
Jason Bourne wrote: So called wisdom from one of the drive by Christians. So CC does the same go for one who leaves your flavor of Christianity, or leaves it all together? Why did Bart Ehrman abandon Christianity? I assume you know who he is. Did he leave because he realized it is false?
Ehrman became an "agnostic" because he thinks Christianity is false; I have no reason to believe he left because of sin. In any event, it does not help the case of your patently fraudulent church.
Caeli enarrant gloriam Dei
(I lost access to my Milesius account, so I had to retrieve this one from the mothballs.)
Jason Bourne wrote: So called wisdom from one of the drive by Christians. So CC does the same go for one who leaves your flavor of Christianity, or leaves it all together? Why did Bart Ehrman abandon Christianity? I assume you know who he is. Did he leave because he realized it is false?
Ehrman became an "agnostic" because he thinks Christianity is false; I have no reason to believe he left because of sin. In any event, it does not help the case of your patently fraudulent church.
What helps with your patently fraudulent church's case?
krose wrote: There are more reasons, some having to do with the kinds of power struggles that are typical in a new organization, and others with how Smith governed. But I'll leave it there.
You gave some good points. However, it still does not explain while most stay today unless because they believe.
I don't believe that anyone gains much by being in the leadership of the LDS church. It is very time consuming and one usually spends days away from family. Not much to boost about there. And the money is not great either. And so, their staying in the church comes from faith.
If the chesney's are happy out of the LDS church, I say, great for them. But I still would like to ask them how they have dealt with all the spiritual experiences they have had in the church. I am sure that they bore their testimony many times and spoke of the spirit. It comes with their turf. And so, how would they explain their leaving and their spiritual experiences? Lets hope they come clean and not have their friends speak for them.
They seem like prime candidates for the exmo conference.
I intend to lay a foundation that will revolutionize the whole world. Joseph Smith We are “to feed the hungry, to clothe the naked, to provide for the widow, to dry up the tear of the orphan, to comfort the afflicted, whether in this church, or in any other, or in no church at all…” Joseph Smith
The Nehor wrote:If sin did not drive them out then it was a sin to leave.
This pretty much sums up Mormonism. Rejecting the teachings of the Mormon church is a sin all by itself. There are three types of people in this world. Faithful Mormons, potential converts, and sinners.
I think that you will find the LDS church has a diverse group of members. Some are like The Nehor and many are not. Most members outside the Mormon corridor are rather blase´ about it all. People leave and people return, it tends to go that way. But no one to my knowledge (among the branches or wards that I attended) ever condemned anyone who left the church.
Most members realize that we are all on some journey. It takes us here and there. And most want the best for that person whether in or outside the church.
I intend to lay a foundation that will revolutionize the whole world. Joseph Smith We are “to feed the hungry, to clothe the naked, to provide for the widow, to dry up the tear of the orphan, to comfort the afflicted, whether in this church, or in any other, or in no church at all…” Joseph Smith
KA, thanks for the OP. He wasn't the first Prominent Mormon, nor will he be the last, to vacate LDSism... Nor will a "...mass exoduse..." follow as wonderd by Nehor.
Some leave while alive. All leave at death. However their departure, they will be replaced by others who think/believe somewhat, but not totally as they believed. Thereby Mormonism evolves, keeping slow-pace with time and culture; making a comfortable place for some while discomforting others...so motivating their lessor sin of leaving, rather than living the greater sin of self-denial and suppression of thought to engage a hoped for Heavenly estate based upon obedience to human imaginings... As I imagine things... Respectfully, Roger * *
Have you noticed what a beautiful day it is? Some can't... "God": nick-name for the Universe...
Chap wrote: Actually, until this man comes onto this board himself and says that he has left the church, "we" can't even proceed on that assumption, can we?
With respect, I think you do have a problem all of your very own, though in my view it is not the one you have referred to above. You have however found a marvellous way to deal with your problem, and I hope it makes you feel all warm and comfortable.
So now the rest of us will get on with the discussion without you, I assume.
Well lets hope that he appears and relates his story. My guess is he will not do that very soon. I am not sure that he is now able to deny the Holy Ghost in relation to what he felt as a member. Much better to hedge his bet and take it from there.
Who doesn't have a problem? Sure I have my problems and I deal with them accordingly as most people on this forum do. And the Chesney's have their problems too.
I intend to lay a foundation that will revolutionize the whole world. Joseph Smith We are “to feed the hungry, to clothe the naked, to provide for the widow, to dry up the tear of the orphan, to comfort the afflicted, whether in this church, or in any other, or in no church at all…” Joseph Smith
Ehrman became an "agnostic" because he thinks Christianity is false;
Correct.
I have no reason to believe he left because of sin.
Great. I am glad you do not attribute all apostasy to some gross sin.
any event, it does not help the case of your patently fraudulent church.
Of course I did not argue that it did now did I.
Nor does it help yours. Your church is as false as you think mine is bubba. There is no Church or religion that is the only truth out there. Christianity is rife with problems. Start with your Bible.
Roger Morrison wrote:KA, thanks for the OP. He wasn't the first Prominent Mormon, nor will he be the last, to vacate LDSism... Nor will a "...mass exoduse..." follow as wonderd by Nehor.
Some leave while alive. All leave at death. However their departure, they will be replaced by others who think/believe somewhat, but not totally as they believed. Thereby Mormonism evolves, keeping slow-pace with time and culture; making a comfortable place for some while discomforting others...so motivating their lessor sin of leaving, rather than living the greater sin of self-denial and suppression of thought to engage a hoped for Heavenly estate based upon obedience to human imaginings... As I imagine things... Respectfully, Roger * *
Actually, it goes something like this: I am tired of it all and I want to leave. I leave but don't resign, just go inactive. Some leave after a while but the great majority just go inactive. No self denial or suppression of thought or hoped for heavenly estate based upon obedience to human imaginings.
Because in the end, the LDS church has not been proven false. The witnesses have not been exposed and all is well in that regard.
Now of course, some may imagine that the church is false (Chesney and others on this board) but in the end such imaginings don't make it so.
I intend to lay a foundation that will revolutionize the whole world. Joseph Smith We are “to feed the hungry, to clothe the naked, to provide for the widow, to dry up the tear of the orphan, to comfort the afflicted, whether in this church, or in any other, or in no church at all…” Joseph Smith