Former LDS Believrs, I need your help

[_Trevor]

I realized that I was not only convinced that Mormonism was not what I had believed it was, but that I also really didn't enjoy participation in the church. Thus, there was insufficient motivation for me to continue involvement. There was no single issue or book that was crucial in my development as an "apostate." I will say, however, that the behavior of a number of online apologists was not encouraging me to stay. Fortunately, things have improved a little bit there. Now that I know who the bozos are, I can focus on what the more genteel and reasonable apologists have to say, and less on the bozos (and by bozos I mean those who behave atrociously in their interactions with questioning members).

[_wenglund]

Hey Wade... nice to see you!

Just curious, but why do you want such a list? Are you writing a book or paper?

Nice to see you as well. I am in the throes of a thread at MaDB that is discussing the relevance of anti-Mormon material to the verity of the restored gospel, and I don't wish to put words into former members mouths about what issues and material influenced their loss of faith. Dastardly, huh?

Also, I'm wondering what you think are the top ten or twenty reasons people stop believing in Mormonism?

I am not sure. That is why I am asking.

Do you think these reasons differ from those who stop believing in other religions, say Scientology, FLDS, JWs, etc. etc. :-)~td~

Again, I have no idea. The scope of the afore-mentioned discussion is specific to the LDS faith, and that is as much as I currently have the time and interest to pursue. But, if you have the time and interest, I would be pleased to hear your investigative report.

Also, will you be responding to my simple request?

Thanks, -Wade Englund-

[_wenglund]

There was no single issue or book that was crucial in my development as an "apostate."

Could you give me a list of the top 10 or so that, together, caused the collapse of your faith?

Thanks, -Wade Englund-

[_Gadianton]

nothing ever written by any critic had a part to play in my leaving. At most, the very most, some standard Bible scholarship played a part, but looking back, a small part. I think "common sense" pretty much explains 95% of it.

After I had already been "out" for a few years, and discovered the standard message boards, I guess you can say that learning here and there from my fellow posters about the life of Joseph Smith would seal the deal in a "personal" way, such that I think less of the church than other religions where as previously, I just thought all religion was false, equally so, and the church might be better than average on a practical level.

[Guest]

Well, to the degree that my "faith" has "collapsed", I would suggest the following as the most damaging:

1. Similarities between LDS Church and other successful (and unsuccessful) religious movements. If you strip away all the parts of the Church that aren't "true" (and are shared by other false religions), what do you get?

2. Evidence for Joseph Smith's lack of translation abilities (first and foremost, the evidence against the Church's theory of translation for the Book of Abraham).

3. Evidence between the "Guided by Omniscent Being" theory and the "Making it Up As They Go Along" theory for Church leadership leaning in what appears to be the "Making It Up As They Go Along" direction.

4. Planted the seed of faith, and found it was a mediocre seed, or that the word is good but not all that great, with little to no soul enlargement; marginal enlightenment, and really not being that delicious.

5. Moroni Christmas Tree toppers.

6. Philosophical doubts about the construction and implementation of the theoretical "Plan of Salvation" (also called the "Plan of Happiness"). To put it bluntly, even if you accept all the claims of Church leaders and their interpretation of the scriptures, it doesn't seem like all that good a plan.

7. David Wright's studies on Isaiah in the Book of Mormon. Dang!

8. This picture. I mean, come on!

9. The shrinking of the Book of Mormon (and the >1 Cumorah Theory).

10. Incompatibility between the the theory of evolution and the Church's teachings on "no physical death before the fall", spiritual pre-creation, and Adam and Eve being the first humans. I'm guessing the scientists are right, and the Church leaders are wrong.

[_bcspace]

THe number 1 issue for all of us is we wanted to sin.

Which, if that was true, would be a fruitless pursuit, since all church members already sin.

Say rather sin without guilt. But that is a fruitless pursuit also.

[_Inconceivable]

What are your ulterior motives, Wade.

Your request demonstrates your inability to recognize the concerns of those you have had dialog with here and other places for years.

I don't find you disarming or sincere.

Of course, to your way of thinking, my perceptions of former members will always be entirely lacking, and my motives will always be suspect and my intents dastardly. But, If you feel the least bit threatened or fearful of my horrifying request, then I acknowledge your freedom not to participate. No one is putting a gun to anyone's head, though such endevours are not for the faint of heart. I do honor your bravery for posting what you did.

Thanks, -Wade Englund-

uh.. Wade. Drama queen.

From the outside of your fishbowl looking in, I think it's an honest (albeit hardball) question. It's not like you just showed up here.

[_Ray A]

Here's my top ten reasons/issues:

1) Beer.

2) Women, lots of them!

3) Porn.

4) Sundays at the beach.

5) Cigarettes and marijuana.

6) LSD.

7) A dislike of self-righteous pricks.

8) Pissing off nerdy, prying, judgemental leaders.

9) 10% more income for gambling.

10) Being free from being a robot for 13 years on Devil's Island.

[_Trevor]

Ray, you are the man.

[_Dr. Shades]

I am attempting to compile a top 10 - 20 list of issues that have lead to loss of LDS faith . . .

I can hook you up with that.

. . . and the material from critics/anti-Mormons that was instramental therein.

That part won't be necessary, since you'll just dismiss it anyway.

Could you provide me with your personal list so I can aggrigate the responses? Or, if such a list has already been vetted, could you point me to it?

John Dehlin has already beaten you to it. For the definitive presentation, see:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uZQJc5SxnVs