CAEMS, secret combinations and church elitism

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_moksha
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Re: CAEMS, secret combinations and church elitism

Post by _moksha »

Dr. Shades wrote:Permit me the insolence of answering on such recipients' behalf, but I think there's a wide divide between a combination and a mere ordinance.


An ordination that is the culmination of years of faithful service and requires separate recomendation and approvals. This is not simply the work of a single individual. Can't say more than that because it is held in secrecy. However, it is safe to say that it is never mentioned in Church.

Does anyone know if the 33rd Degree of Masonry is this complex?
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_Mercury
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Re: The Holy Spirit of Promise = CAEMS

Post by _Mercury »

Inconceivable wrote:
26 Verily, verily, I say unto you, if a man marry a wife according to my word, and they are sealed by the Holy Spirit of promise, according to mine appointment, and he or she shall commit any sin or transgression of the new and everlasting covenant whatever, and all manner of blasphemies, and if they commit no murder wherein they shed innocent blood, yet they shall come forth in the first resurrection, and enter into their exaltation; but they shall be destroyed in the flesh, and shall be delivered unto the buffetings of Satan unto the day of redemption, saith the Lord God.

(Doctrine and Covenants | Section 132:26)


I had done a paradigm on the subject a number of years ago. After a couple in our family got their CAEMS. I'll try to find it. Those that have been given this ordinance/promise can do no wrong so long as they don't blaspheme against the Holy Ghost (whatever that really means).

I reference the verse above because it may directly relate to John D. Lee's postumous full re-instatement of his temple blessings in the 1950's.

Evidently, John D. Lee did not shed any innocent blood.

murder of the guilty = justified, exaltation promised

murder of innocents = unjustified (but what does innocent really mean, right?)

Free passes, anyone? Aspire to this little club.


It is this free pass that is most troublesome about the CAEMS, at least to me. In this it is the ultimate vaccine against doubt, a vehicle for highly unethical behavior, etc. The practitioner goes from a state of constant worry of committing sin to being able to not worry at all concerning the consequences of his or her action. This sets the stage at the top of the Mormon power pyramid allowing an "ends justify the means" mentality.

The CAEMS is the most scary and, dare I say it Evil Mormon doctrine, possibly enabling the book cooking and MMM to name two.
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_DarkHelmet
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Re: CAEMS, secret combinations and church elitism

Post by _DarkHelmet »

Based on what I learned about secret combinations while growing up in the church, the church is hypocritical about it. I don't mind the church having their own secret combinations, because most organizations, especially religious organizations, do. Recently an LDS relative and I were discussing the financial meltdown, and he predicatably described the leaders of the banking industry, corporations, and government as a secret combination. It's easy to find secret combinations. Just find any group of managers in a closed door meeting and voila, you have a secret combination. They should just get rid of the secret combinations = bad doctrine if they are going to organize the church like a corporation.
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_Inconceivable
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Re: The Holy Spirit of Promise = CAEMS

Post by _Inconceivable »

Mercury wrote:It is this free pass that is most troublesome about the CAEMS, at least to me. In this it is the ultimate vaccine against doubt, a vehicle for highly unethical behavior, etc. The practitioner goes from a state of constant worry of committing sin to being able to not worry at all concerning the consequences of his or her action. This sets the stage at the top of the Mormon power pyramid allowing an "ends justify the means" mentality.

The CAEMS is the most scary and, dare I say it Evil Mormon doctrine, possibly enabling the book cooking and MMM to name two.

Qualifying for a CAEMS is progression in leadership based - show me the ward janitor with a CAEMS and I'll eat my hat. This club is exclusive to couples where their husbands have paid their dues within hierarchal leadership (ie. temple president, patriarch, various GA positions). Even most of them do not qualify.

The relatives I knew that got their CAEMS pretty much told everyone they (he and his wife)were getting it when they got their invitation from Spencer Kimball (later, my relative even approved of the letter being published in his biography). At the time he was a retired very successful businessman and he held a prestigious position of administrational leadership for the church. He and his wife had been close personal friends of the prophet for 50 years. As a youngster I will always remember that my relative threw the trash bag out the car window when it got full, and didn't stop to help people in car accidents (even though he would take a picture of them occasionally). I was with him one time when he flashed his temple recommend to a cop in a little Utah town when he got pulled over for speeding. Afterwards we detoured to the judge's house to "work out the misunderstanding".

Here is something to ponder:

According to the most correct of any book, when someone truly becomes a Child of Christ, his heart is changed. He has no more desire to do evil, but to do good continually. And yet, even this person may never qualify himself for a CAEMS in this life.

11 And I would that ye should remember also, that this is the name [Child of Christ] that I said I should give unto you that never should be blotted out, except it be through transgression; therefore, take heed that ye do not transgress, that the name be not blotted out of your hearts.
12 I say unto you, I would that ye should remember to retain the name written always in your hearts, that ye are not found on the left hand of God, but that ye hear and know the voice by which ye shall be called, and also, the name by which he shall call you.

(Book of Mormon | Mosiah 5:11 - 12)

However, if you are a born again Christian, you have your CAEMS ticket punched. Think about it.

(edited to clarify)
Last edited by Guest on Tue May 26, 2009 6:30 pm, edited 1 time in total.
_Mercury
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Re: The Holy Spirit of Promise = CAEMS

Post by _Mercury »

Inconceivable wrote:
However, if you are a born again Christian, you have your CAEMS ticket punched. Think about it.


I never thought about it that way! Excellent comparrison.

Anthropologically speaking, the social currency afforded to the top members is in itself meted out. Religion is (on some levels) a system of creating imaginary needs that are held out to the practitioner as a carrot, stringing them along as the hierarchy sees fit. The CAEMS is the top carrot, pulled out in an "executive washroom" fashion and backed up through familial and cultural legacies.

At the heart of this matter is a landscape of priveledges and folkways exclusive to a system of inherited status as Mormon royalty. This rather effective control mechanism keeps out the "rabble" and legitimizes a percieved limited priveledge setting apart the "chosen" as elite.

My mission president gave a veiled talk for his last zone conference tour acrost the MMM (the mission in the Minnesota area, not the bloodbath). In this talk he stressed in veiled language the Holy Spirit of Promise and the power that came to those who were blessed by it. The rest of the talk was a smattering of business talk, so go figure.

All in all this is Anthropolgical to me as social currency is at the heart of how I see the CAEMS. Its really amazing and the silly and woorysome fact of the matter is that your rank and file TBM has no idea there is a king making ceremony that sets apart the unwashed from the Hegemonic handfull of ruling Mormon families.
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_Scratchopolis
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Re: CAEMS, secret combinations and church elitism

Post by _Scratchopolis »

The LDS concept of what a secret combination is is plain in scripture.

One of the elements of a secret combination is secret oaths taken. Another is that those oaths are designed to protect the oathtakers from being accountable for their actions as they murder and get gain.

As no LDS Temple ordinance it does not qualify as a secret combination. Therefore, no hypocrisy.
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Re: CAEMS, secret combinations and church elitism

Post by _Mercury »

Scratchopolis wrote:The LDS concept of what a secret combination is is plain in scripture.

One of the elements of a secret combination is secret oaths taken. Another is that those oaths are designed to protect the oathtakers from being accountable for their actions as they murder and get gain.

As no LDS Temple ordinance it does not qualify as a secret combination. Therefore, no hypocrisy.


lets break down your statement here:
One of the elements of a secret combination is secret oaths taken


The CAEMS is a secret oath unknown to the vast majority of Mormons. Point in favor of CAEMS being a secret combination.

Another is that those oaths are designed to protect the oathtakers from being accountable for their actions as they murder and get gain.


Once again, the CAEMS fits this profile as it sets the member loose with no consequences in the hereafter for their actions.

As no LDS Temple ordinance it does not qualify as a secret combination. Therefore, no hypocrisy.


I am unsure if you are just trying to be sarcastic here or just blind, so if this is a funnny haha post then I get the humor. If you are serious I am once again presented with statements in total contradiction to the prerequisites you have set yourself.
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Re: CAEMS, secret combinations and church elitism

Post by _Inconceivable »

Scratchopolis wrote:The LDS concept of what a secret combination is is plain in scripture.

One of the elements of a secret combination is secret oaths taken. Another is that those oaths are designed to protect the oathtakers from being accountable for their actions as they murder and get gain.

As no LDS Temple ordinance it does not qualify as a secret combination. Therefore, no hypocrisy.


You misunderstood.

For the murderer John D. Lee to receive the fullness of his priesthood and the promise of his exaltation (posthumously) is a solemn mockery of all things considered holy by those simple souls that are capable of quantifying such things.

The suits gave a confessed convicted murderer everything back.

Calculated? Intentional? Deliberate? Public?

Was that the promise Young gave him in order to take the blame for the church's reprehensible act? Secret Combinations?
_Scratchopolis
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Re: CAEMS, secret combinations and church elitism

Post by _Scratchopolis »

Mercury wrote:
Scratchopolis wrote:The LDS concept of what a secret combination is is plain in scripture.

One of the elements of a secret combination is secret oaths taken. Another is that those oaths are designed to protect the oathtakers from being accountable for their actions as they murder and get gain.

As no LDS Temple ordinance it does not qualify as a secret combination. Therefore, no hypocrisy.


lets break down your statement here:
One of the elements of a secret combination is secret oaths taken


The CAEMS is a secret oath unknown to the vast majority of Mormons. Point in favor of CAEMS being a secret combination.

Another is that those oaths are designed to protect the oathtakers from being accountable for their actions as they murder and get gain.


Once again, the CAEMS fits this profile as it sets the member loose with no consequences in the hereafter for their actions.

As no LDS Temple ordinance it does not qualify as a secret combination. Therefore, no hypocrisy.


I am unsure if you are just trying to be sarcastic here or just blind, so if this is a funnny haha post then I get the humor. If you are serious I am once again presented with statements in total contradiction to the prerequisites you have set yourself.


So this boils down to, "HA! It's secret and secret is one of the words in secret combination. Woo-hoo. Gotcha."

No consequences in the hereafter? What are you smoking? The scriptures are clear that if there are some who are saved now and safe that if they commit any sins they will be delivered to hell for punishment for those sins still. Hardly no consequences. Also, the prereq is to murder and get gain. It's strongly implied (and shown in the Book of Mormon) that this gain is wealth in the financial sense.
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Re: CAEMS, secret combinations and church elitism

Post by _Scratchopolis »

Inconceivable wrote:
Scratchopolis wrote:The LDS concept of what a secret combination is is plain in scripture.

One of the elements of a secret combination is secret oaths taken. Another is that those oaths are designed to protect the oathtakers from being accountable for their actions as they murder and get gain.

As no LDS Temple ordinance it does not qualify as a secret combination. Therefore, no hypocrisy.


You misunderstood.

For the murderer John D. Lee to receive the fullness of his priesthood and the promise of his exaltation (posthumously) is a solemn mockery of all things considered holy by those simple souls that are capable of quantifying such things.

The suits gave a confessed convicted murderer everything back.

Calculated? Intentional? Deliberate? Public?

Was that the promise Young gave him in order to take the blame for the church's reprehensible act? Secret Combinations?


Ahhhh, so these LDS decided to defy Book of Mormon scripture that only Christ can judge a person and decided to barter salvation? :rolleyes:
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