To Whom is God Talking?

[_The Nehor]

Most will reject it -- that's "accepted wisdom?" Wrong on so many levels. It makes God look bad and it makes you look bad. I hope the two of you will be happy together.

Yes, all those scriptures about gathering them in in small drabs and the world hating Christ is not just puffy air, it's what we believe. I have a robust enough faith in God's omniscience that I don't think he's experimenting. I also think he knows how many are going to heed and obey.

Not sure why it's wrong on so many levels.

I'm sure God's failure in your popularity poll saddens him greatly. Maybe he'll send jacuzzis down to hell to make up for it. I know I won't. I agree with C.S. Lewis that the charge of cruelty is ridiculous when applied to God and the devil and his minions only use it because they're boring. Try accusing him of being a gambler and you'll still be off but at least much closer to the mark.

We're quite happy thank you.

[_JAK]

truth dancer,

I'm not sure that I understand what's wrong about one thinking that God communicates with them. Can you explain why you think it's wrong/odd/ or whatever?

One problem is that when people think “God communicates with them,” they soon conclude that they speak for God. It’s a reasonable conclusion. God talks to me. Therefore, I understand God. I know what God thinks and what God wants as a result of that mentality.

It’s not particularly “odd.” Many people have claimed that God talks directly to them. People like Pat Robertson, the late Jerry Falwell, and many which TD mentioned as well as others.

This mental delusion is manifest in: Believe as I say, or God will damn you. Extended, it translates to: Do as I say, or I will assassinate you.

Consider the murder of Dr. Tiller in his own church.

Many who attack Women’s Health Care Services (and kill doctors who do abortions) believe that God has communicated with them and further that God has told them what to do.

JAK

[_JAK]

“Dr. Tiller's vicious, cold-blooded, murder was carried out apparently by a man associated with a terrorist organization that hides behind the word "Christian" to fool ignorant people into supporting it. They didn't get their marching orders from Christ's teachings, because everything they stand for is diametrically opposed to true Christianity.”
Source

JAK

[_The Nehor]

This mental delusion is manifest in: Believe as I say, or God will damn you. Extended, it translates to: Do as I say, or I will assassinate you.

I confessed all of my diagnosed mental and psychological issues a long time ago and now ask again to hear about yours AGAIN. Why are you dodging this? I think it's a fair question considering how often you accuse others of delusions. :)

Hugs and Kisses,

The Nehor

[_Jersey Girl]

Clearly some of the people here have never seen "Men in Black".

Clearly, some of the people here do not live with Pugs.

[_Sethbag]

If you agree, why would you discount that one of those life forms could communicate with us?

Do scientists discount that possibility?

I don't think they discount the possibility, however I don't think scientists have any idea by what mechanism life forms on other planets could travel to earth, and communicate with humans. It's considered improbable, until and unless new understandings in science uncover mechanisms by which this could occur. As Morissey said earlier, alien life is still only conjectured - it has never been demonstrated. I personally believe the likelihood of alien life is very high, however, until it's demonstrated by evidence, we cannot say for sure that it exists.

[_Danna]

To whom is God talking? (Or better, who claims God is speaking to them)?

Here are a few names that come to my mind:

Brian David Mitchel (Elizabeth Smart's kidnapper)
Warren Jeffs
The Nehor*
Nightlion*
BaethKu*
Jim Jones
Yisrayl Hawkins
Neale Donald Walsch
David Koresh
Winston Blackmore
Ron and Dan Lafferty
Jim Harmston
Paul Kingston
My former bishop

Who else?

And, while the LDS church claims God is speaking to their prophet, has TSM ever made the claim? GBH seemed to suggest God did not directly speak to him but that he got an impression or two.

And, is it official doctrine that God speaks to the LDS prophet?

~td~


*Posters here on MDB

My biological father, Richard, talks to God!

He has done so ever since accidental cyanide poisoning in 1986 (he was a beekeeper, a farmer called in his help to remove a wild swarm from a building after first attempting to poison them by smearing cyanide wasp-bait around the area. Richard absorbed the cyanide through cuts on his hands).

He was technically dead briefly, and apparently had some version of an NDE, but due to the brain damage his version has him meeting God, and receiving his mission to call people back to God. Which had us gob-smacked since he was previous a card carrying communist (Maoist, NOT Marxist) with a history of anti-Vietnam war, anti-US, anti-military protest activity.

His warnings and prophecies actually make sense in very convoluted ways. Some gems:

The Taiwanese are actually Nazis who are continuing Hitler's mission to spread fascism worldwide. (We think that this is a carry-over from his pro-China/Mao days) His job is to oppose all Taiwanese business activity in New Zealand and world-wide and most especially the next-door neighbors. The Taiwanese are also trying to track him down and kill him, since he is Jewish and the Nazi mission is to destroy the Jews (actually he has no known Jewish ancestry, but he IS Jesus of course, which places him at risk.)

In the 90s he started self-medicating with natural herbs. This resulted in a whole new mission when he discovered that Marijuana is actually The Tree of Life (ToL). One can only understand the Bible after partaking of the ToL. His mission is to spread this knowledge, to which end he grew it and distributed it for free. Needless to say this got him in to a lot of trouble, until he and the police reached an unstated agreement that they would not bother him as long as he stopped distributing the ToL. (He can be arrested, but is not medically/mentally fit to be incarcerated; he is sent to hospital where he can only be kept for a few weeks, as he is not crazy enough to be committed involuntarily) Now he just spreads the word, and writes very long letters to the police, judges, and politicians. I suspect he has been randomly sowing seeds around the place, they are popping up like weeds all over his neighborhood.

[_Sethbag]

I'm torn here, Danna, and I beg your forgiveness. On the one hand, I want to laugh and say your story is awesome, but on the other hand, it's your biological father, and his mind has been impaired for the last 23 years by an accident not of his own making. I'm very sorry for his mishap. If there is any silver lining in his story at all, it might be that at least he has added a lot of spice to life (though I'm sure, from the point of view of the judges and police and other recipients of his rambling screeds, of some spices a little goes a long way).

It does illustrate rather well a perfect example of "revelation", even direct communication with a deity, being a fabrication of a person's own mind.

[_BaethKu]

One of the other two--B...Ku--seems to have too much class for a down-&-out prophetic brough-haw.

I am certain about not being able to call fire down from heaven or anything else that might constitute participation in a prophetic brouhaha. As I keep saying, I am not claiming to be a prophet, and I am usually very cautious when others make such claims. I have to confess reservations about Nightlion. In reading elements of his theology, I see much creativity that does not match up with my understanding or taste particularly good to me.

Still, I'm not here to bag on him. The man knows a lot of stuff, and his life story is very moving. It is in reading his life story, and not his theology, that you get a feeling for the Spirit that worked in his life, imho.

[_JAK]

If you agree, why would you discount that one of those life forms could communicate with us?

Do scientists discount that possibility?

I don't think they discount the possibility, however I don't think scientists have any idea by what mechanism life forms on other planets could travel to earth, and communicate with humans. It's considered improbable, until and unless new understandings in science uncover mechanisms by which this could occur. As Morissey said earlier, alien life is still only conjectured - it has never been demonstrated. I personally believe the likelihood of alien life is very high, however, until it's demonstrated by evidence, we cannot say for sure that it exists.

Well stated with appropriate qualifiers, Sethbag.

Since we now know there are billions and billions of suns much like our own yet some larger and some smaller, it’s a reasonable consideration that some of those suns have planets revolving around them. Given that reasonable consideration, it is likely that some form of life has evolved where conditions are favorable.

Our Hubble Space Telescope looks far more deeply into space than was possible to look with earth-bound telescopes. This window on the universe has the most promise to date for discovery of planets which could support life forms.

It is also possible that the Hubble will find planets which once supported life forms in the past, yet do not support them today.

We know our own planet supported species of the dinosaur during The Mesozoic Era which began approximately 245 million years ago and lasted for 180 million years. As the source states: It is sometimes called the “Age of Reptiles.”

But, the earth no longer has dinosaurs. If we could have viewed the earth at the height of the dinosaur age, we would have seen an earth which supported life and which we would not recognize.

If there are planets which support life of some form and even if Hubble (or some other eye from earth finds it), we would see it at only a point in time of our viewing.

JAK