And about Peterson's claimed hebrew/jewish scholar contacts

[_Daniel Peterson]

Claiming that you gain insights and revelation from God is, indeed... Crowing. You have experienced the Divine, apparently. I do not see the point of making unsubstantiated claims, nor do I see the point of sharing with a diverse crowd that you have special insight and knowledge granted to you by God, but do not wish to share it.

Personal things are personal. And voyeurs are voyeurs.

You're simply going to have to learn to live in a world that has featured and continues to feature such arrogant boasters as St. John of the Cross, the Baal Shem Tov, Kabir, Isaiah, St. Thomas Aquinas, Plotinus, al-Ghazali, St. Francis of Assisi, the apostle Paul, Rabi‘a al-‘Adawiyya, Jesus, Ibn al-‘Arabi, the prophet Amos, and the rest of their ilk. I'm small potatoes in comparison to this obnoxious bunch.

Very Respectfully,

Sure. The respect is palpable.

[_Doctor CamNC4Me]

You're simply going to have to learn to live in a world that has featured and continues to feature such arrogant boasters as St. John of the Cross, the Baal Shem Tov, Kabir, Isaiah, St. Thomas Aquinas, Plotinus, al-Ghazali, St. Francis of Assisi, the apostle Paul, Rabi‘a al-‘Adawiyya, Jesus, Ibn al-‘Arabi, the prophet Amos, and the rest of their ilk. I'm small potatoes in comparison to this obnoxious bunch.

....

Sure. The respect is palpable.

Sir,

Your boastfulness is noted along with other recipients of Divine Insight. I am gratified to know your god has spoken to you, in whatever form, and you thought it enough to share that information with us without really sharing it with us. It helps us less fortunate types to understand your mindset a little better. Voyeurs we all are, apparently.

Very Respectfully,

Docotr CamNC4Me

[_Gadianton Plumber]

Doctor Can,

My God has recently visited me with a great vision of truth and power. It was an amazing spiritual experience.

You want to know what he said? Not for the likes of you!

[Guest]

-1-

Here's my arrogant boasting and hubris, regarding this particular issue, on full, appalling display:

I giggle when people say "I learn something new everytime" because I know they are just repeating the cliché.

I can't say that I've learned something new every time. But I often do.

What an interesting irony. Members are told to go to temple for answers, yet questions there are discouraged (unless you go through the "official" filter of the temple presidency). Egads.

I go to the temple for answers. I bring questions. I get answers.

If there's an irony in my own experience, I've missed it completely.

I've often learned things, gained new insights, and received answers to questions in the temple.

What unspeakably pretentious self-importance! All decent people should treat blustering elitist braggarts like me with vocal contempt.

Why do so few believing Latter-day Saints find this a congenial place to discuss their faith?

-2-

So we see here quite often how many supposed high profile jewish/hebrew scholar and rabbi people that Mr Peterson hangs with.

Question:Does he know of any of these folks who would support the LDS claim to the requirement or practice of temple marriage ceremonies in ancient jewish/hebrew culture?

None spring to mind, although I can name a few that have expressed praise for the Latter-day Saint temples and their significance.

This was the second post of the thread -- that is, it immediately follows the opening post -- and it seems to me that it answered the question posed in the opening post.

Yet, ignoring the direct answer to his question as if it hadn't been given, the author of the opening post then moved to a different question:

None spring to mind, although I can name a few that have expressed praise for the Latter-day Saint temples and their significance.

CFR Please name and reference a few and what they claimed was the significance about the LDS temples.

This question, too, received direct answers:

CFR Please name and reference a few and what they claimed was the significance about the LDS temples.

Here's a nice, brief YouTube video that includes two eminent scholars (Frank Moore Cross and the late Krister Stendahl, both of Harvard University) who see real significance in the LDS temple:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-x_-TQivCx8

Cross and Stendahl are not just reputable scholars. In their respectivefields, they are enormous names. (For what it's worth, Stendahl was both the dean of Harvard Divinity School and the Lutheran bishop of Stockholm, Sweden -- in effect, the head of the Swedish state church).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frank_Moore_Cross

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Krister_Stendahl

CFR Please name and reference a few and what they claimed was the significance about the LDS temples.

Sure thing. Rabbi Jacob Milgrom, professor emeritus at UC Berkeley, discusses the Mormon perception of ritual and temple purity as a close analogue to the ancient Israelite perception. That's in Reflections on Mormonism: Judaeo-Christian Parallels. Larry Schiffman of NYU also comments favorably on the video Dan Peterson referenced. You can find a lot of ideologies that parallel those of the Mormon perception of the temple in Menahem Haran's Temple and Temple Service in Ancient Israel (specifically the idea that there were numerous temples up and down Syria-Palestine).

Yet the author of the opening post continues to claim, rather mysteriously, that those who have responded to him are trying to evade his questions.

[_Doctor CamNC4Me]

Why do so few believing Latter-day Saints find this a congenial place to discuss their faith?

Sir,

You claim divine communication. How utterly hubristic! And for the record, I doubt there are any Mormons that find this place congenial. What a nonsensical thing to utter!

Very Respectfully,

Doctor CamNC4Me

[_Daniel Peterson]

You claim divine communication. How utterly hubristic

The fact that you evidently regard all or most claims of religious experience as arrogant says a great deal -- but by far mostly, I believe, about you.

And for the record, I doubt there are any Mormons that find this place congenial. What a nonsensical thing to utter!

My point precisely. Which means that this place, whatever Shades's hopes for it may have been when he founded it, is almost certainly doomed to remain the contemptuous and insignificant little echo chamber that it essentially is today.

Which is perfectly fine with me.

Very Respectfully

There is not a trace of genuine respect in your posts.

[_Doctor CamNC4Me]

The fact that you evidently regard all or most claims of religious experience as arrogant says a great deal -- but by far mostly, I believe, about you.


My point precisely. Which means that this place, whatever Shades's hopes for it may have been when he founded it, is almost certainly doomed to remain the contemptuous and insignificant little echo chamber that it essentially is today.

Which is perfectly fine with me.


There is not a trace of genuine respect in your posts.

Sir,

Perhaps projection is your strong suit when participating in this "empty echo chamber" of a forum? You are now a contributor, and I use that term very loosely, with 5,000+ posts.

You claimed divine intervention, Sir. You then declined to explain it in any detail claiming "privacy" as your reason. What an odd thing to do! You expose your spirituality, and then immediately shield it. I find that odd beyond reason. It is, in fact, quite unreasonable to boast of divine privilege and then pretend modesty prevents you from providing your audience with details of the matter.

As far as you determining the level of respect you think I afford you or other posters on this forum I shall refer you back to my first paragraph, Sir. And please, use my title when you address me; I offer you the same out of respect for an academic peer.

Very Respectfully,

Doctor CamNC4Me

[_Daniel Peterson]

You claimed divine intervention, Sir. You then declined to explain it in any detail claiming "privacy" as your reason. What an odd thing to do! You expose your spirituality, and then immediately shield it. I find that odd beyond reason.

Tough.

It is, in fact, quite unreasonable to boast of divine privilege and then pretend modesty prevents you from providing your audience with details of the matter.

It's unreasonable on your part to mischaracterize my comments as boasting.

But it's certainly not unreasonable for a person to keep the details of private experiences to himself or herself. As, I suspect, you yourself both know and do.

You don't even share your own name, but you demand that I submit personal experiences that I consider sacred and private so that you and Some Schmo and solomarineris and Joey and Polygamy Porter and Mercury and TAK and Gadianton Plumber and the like can paw them over. No normal person would consider that a reasonable request, let alone denounce me as arrogant for failing to comply with it.

This is simply another attempted Scratchoscopy.

As far as you determining the level of respect you think I afford you or other posters on this forum I shall refer you back to my first paragraph, Sir. And please, use my title when you address me; I offer you the same out of respect for an academic peer.

Nonsense.

If you're really an academic peer, incidentally, supply your actual name and your academic affiliation. It won't change the way I treat you -- which has been far more respectful than your behavior toward me, in any case -- but it will demonstrate that you're not lying.

Very Respectfully

Uh huh.

Doctor CamNC4Me

One of the Scratches, I suspect. A sockpuppet for Scratch 1, perhaps, or (as if there's any real difference) for the late Kishkumen Scratch.

As is always the case with Scratches, the interest is in the person, not in the subject. The quest is never for substance, but for gossip and personal details. And, in this thread as in so many others, the Scratch destroys the conversation -- which, it may be distantly recalled, was about the attitude of scholars (particularly but not solely Jewish ones) toward Latter-day Saint temples.

[_Doctor CamNC4Me]

As is always the case with Scratches, the interest is in the person, not in the subject. The quest is never for substance, but for gossip and personal details. And, in this thread as in so many others, the Scratch destroys the conversation -- which, it may be distantly recalled, was about the attitude of scholars (particularly but not solely Jewish ones) toward Latter-day Saint temples.

Sir,

I almost feel like I am reading a description of yourself. Sadly, what a bizarre surrealist moment this has turned out to be, Dr. Peterson.

Another one of our peers once said:

Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster.

Very Respectfully,

Doctor CamNC4Me

[_Daniel Peterson]

Have fun, Scratch.

What a weird hobby you have.