And about Peterson's claimed hebrew/jewish scholar contacts

[_Joey]

Well, again, not the question that was asked.

So, what was the question? I thought you wanted to know whether any Jewish scholar agrees with the Mormons about temple marriage, and I thought I said that, no, to my knowledge none did.

No, to be exact, you said: "I don't know of any Jewish scholar who, on the subject of eternal marriage in temples, is a Mormon. I've never expected to find one, and don't much care."

The question asked about Jewish scholars. Not Jewish scholars who are Mormons. It was a question of Jewish temple history.

But thanks for the Millet!

I wish I could thank you for the predictable sneering put-down. But I don't appreciate them, don't think they're civil, and don't think they're called for.

The civility of a "Millet" should be addressed to the author. In sports we might call it a "Buckner". In pieces of work, a "Rembrandt". In acts of disloyalty, a "Benedict Arnold". So in acts of avoidance, we have a Millet. Nothing un-civil about it, just factual. Take it up with Millet, he is the originator!

You've treated me with aggressive personal contempt since our first encounter, and I wonder what you think that accomplishes, or what you think that says about me.

You do have a flair for the prescribed LDS persecution complex when needed to change the focus of the conversation, don't ya. Get over it Daniel - you haven't won any sympathy votes. As all here have expressed, you give as good as you get.

What we see is that those who should best know the history of the ancient jewish temples see no such evidence nor support for the LDS claim of temple marriages and LDS ceremonies within the temple no matter how hard the LDS church tries to create a link for their members.

What we see is that non-Mormons don't agree with Mormons. I'm not sure why that should be surprising or newsworthy.

No, what we have again is an LDS Church teaching of a history claim of what happened in ancient Jewish Temples not supported by those one would expect to know most about them - Jewish scholars. This is not about religious faith, it is about history.

It's a parallel of John Clark Book of Mormon scholarship not being supported by his academic peers in archaeology/history.

Isolate, then insulate!

[_Daniel Peterson]

So, what was the question? I thought you wanted to know whether any Jewish scholar agrees with the Mormons about temple marriage, and I thought I said that, no, to my knowledge none did.

No, to be exact, you said: "I don't know of any Jewish scholar who, on the subject of eternal marriage in temples, is a Mormon. I've never expected to find one, and don't much care."

The question asked about Jewish scholars. Not Jewish scholars who are Mormons. It was a question of Jewish temple history.

That question has been answered. More than once. I know of no non-LDS Jewish scholars who believe that eternal marriages were performed in Solomon's Temple or in Herod's Temple.

There. I've now answered it yet again.

Off hand, though, as I've mentioned, I don't know of any LDS scholars who believe that they can demonstrate that, either. I suspect that no such marriages were performed in either Solomon's or Herod's sanctuary.

No, what we have again is an LDS Church teaching of a history claim of what happened in ancient Jewish Temples not supported by those one would expect to know most about them - Jewish scholars. This is not about religious faith, it is about history. . . . Isolate, then insulate!

Why on earth would you imagine that Jewish scholars are necessarily the final authorities on ancient Jewish temples? Is it somehow genetic? Do they have access to ancient Jewish temple builders by means of Jewish-only seances? Isn't it a matter of knowing the textual and archaeological data? Isn't such data as open to non-Jews as to Jews?

With regard to temple studies, incidentally, here are three attempts by LDS authors to hide their views from non-Mormons ("isolate, then insulate") and to demonstrate ("only in Provo") that they know nothing about ancient Jewish temples:

John M. Lundquist, The Temple: Meeting Place of Heaven and Earth (London and New York: Thames and Hudson, 1993).

William J. Hamblin and David Rolph Seely, Solomon's Temple: Myth and History (London and New York: Thames and Hudson, 2007).

John M. Lundquist, The Temple of Jerusalem: Past, Present, and Future (Westport, CN: Praeger, 2008).

These are exceptionally interesting books. The latter two are both dedicated to the memory of Hugh Nibley, by the way.

[_Rollo Tomasi]

As is always the case with Scratches, the interest is in the person, not in the subject. The quest is never for substance, but for gossip and personal details. And, in this thread as in so many others, the Scratch destroys the conversation -- which, it may be distantly recalled, was about the attitude of scholars (particularly but not solely Jewish ones) toward Latter-day Saint temples.

Sir,

I almost feel like I am reading a description of yourself. Sadly, what a bizarre surrealist moment this has turned out to be, Dr. Peterson.

Another one of our peers once said:

Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster.

Very Respectfully,

Doctor CamNC4Me

Don't be too disheartened Doc, this is just standard DCP. Whenever asked to give substance, he attacks the messenger. After a while he quits the bb in a huff, saying he'll never return ... but he always does.

[_RockSlider]

Seems to me DP has answered the question the same way serveral times, I don't get what is being expected of him from there?

[_Doctor Scratch]

Doctor Cam---

I'd like to urge you very strongly to keep mum w/r/t this post:

If you're really an academic peer, incidentally, supply your actual name and your academic affiliation. It won't change the way I treat you -- which has been far more respectful than your behavior toward me, in any case -- but it will demonstrate that you're not lying.

Maybe it won't affect the way he treats you on the board, but I'd be willing to bet that he'd tell everyone on the Skinny List about you, and before you know it, you'd be getting emails from MAD apologists, harassing phone calls from Louis Midgley, and John Tvedtnes would try to interfere with your tenure process.

[_Doctor CamNC4Me]

Thank you, Doctor Scratch. You have, indeed, given me pause. I was in the middle of addressing that point with Dr. Peterson by providing him all the information he requested. Had you not reminded me of his sordid and disreputable behavior toward ex-Mormons and critics reference their personal lives I might have found myself among his victims.

Thank you again for the prescient timing.

Very Respectfully,

Doctor CamNC4Me

[_Daniel Peterson]

It's amusing to watch Scratch's sock puppets converse with each other.

Maybe it won't affect the way he treats you on the board, but I'd be willing to bet that he'd tell everyone on the Skinny List about you, and before you know it, you'd be getting emails from MAD apologists, harassing phone calls from Louis Midgley, and John Tvedtnes would try to interfere with your tenure process.

What's more, we'll tap your phones, drain your bank accounts, torch your garage, slash your tires, drink from your water taps, hack your computer, sow weeds in your garden, paint graffiti on your driveway, write stupid letters to local newspapers in your name, register you to vote in Chicago, scribble mustaches on your photographs, plant your fingerprints at crime scenes, and substitute Britney Spears CDs for your Milli Vanilli collection.

[_RockSlider]

What's more, we'll tap your phones, drain your bank accounts, torch your garage, slash your tires, drink from your water taps, hack your computer, sow weeds in your garden, paint graffiti on your driveway, write stupid letters to local newspapers in your name, register you to vote in Chicago, scribble mustaches on your photographs, plant your fingerprints at crime scenes, and substitute Britney Spears CDs for your Milli Vanilli collection.

Don't know if you saw it, I did make mention of the "FBI" (Hersel Pedersons term, not mine). I have to admit it did cross my mind if one like you had a special "calling" here?

[_Rollo Tomasi]

It's amusing to watch Scratch's sock puppets converse with each other.

Maybe it won't affect the way he treats you on the board, but I'd be willing to bet that he'd tell everyone on the Skinny List about you, and before you know it, you'd be getting emails from MAD apologists, harassing phone calls from Louis Midgley, and John Tvedtnes would try to interfere with your tenure process.

What's more, we'll tap your phones, drain your bank accounts, torch your garage, slash your tires, drink from your water taps, hack your computer, sow weeds in your garden, paint graffiti on your driveway, write stupid letters to local newspapers in your name, register you to vote in Chicago, scribble mustaches on your photographs, plant your fingerprints at crime scenes, and substitute Britney Spears CDs for your Milli Vanilli collection.

Or the ultimate weapon: the SCMC will ask DCP to meet with you and try convince you it's all true.

[_Daniel Peterson]

Don't know if you saw it, I did make mention of the "FBI" (Hersel Pedersons term, not mine). I have to admit it did cross my mind if one like you had a special "calling" here?

I have no calling here. The time I spend on this board reflects a serious psychological defect, not an ecclesiastical assignment.