karl61 wrote:The more I look at the video the crazier it gets. The "big" guy at the beginning interrupts his coworker by barging in and giving them an ultimatum. This clearly escalates the situation worse. He is now physically close which makes the one he is talking to uncomfortable. Then you see him reach and grab the guy. This was ridiculous. They should have talked to the guy for ten minutes and every time he got louder the security should have stayed calm and talk to them in a professional manner.
They clearly have not trained together to work a situation like this; this will come out in court and they will get hammered.
Not a chance on earth. They did absolutely nothing wrong, and ultimatum's are an absolute necessity in situations like that. The first guy is obviously being more patient than the second, but neither was outside the scope of his training, and a final ultimatum was inevitable.
karl61 wrote:If they called the police and the two left they'd have some explaining to do to the cops when they showed up
what! why? unless they have a history of calling in bogus reports.
Police officer time is a valuable resource, and they don't like to have it tied up by professional security personnel who are only going to tell them the kids ran off. When professional security personnel call the cops they are expected to have someone detained when they get there. I understand that you want their behavior to be inappropriate, but it simply was not. They did everything by the book, and it's universally handled that way. If you find that illogical then whoopdie doo, but it's how security works, and it's perfectly normal.
karl61 wrote:It's weird - I use always hear the radio say the terms:
10-97 UTL 10-8
and guess what -it was just one less report for he day.
10-97 arrived at scene UTL unable to locate 10-8 in service.
And are you going to state that this was in response to professional security personnel calls, or are you going to leave that implicit and hope everyone concludes it?
karl61 wrote:It's weird - I use always hear the radio say the terms:
10-97 UTL 10-8
and guess what -it was just one less report for he day.
10-97 arrived at scene UTL unable to locate 10-8 in service.
And are you going to state that this was in response to professional security personnel calls, or are you going to leave that implicit and hope everyone concludes it?
No - that is what a city police officer in Los Angeles or Orange County says when he is sent to a call and can' locate the parties. It takes two seconds. They don't get all mad because the people are not there. Maybe if it's in a population of 1500 and there are no calls for the day but in a large city. forget it, They don't care.
Last edited by Guest on Fri Jul 31, 2009 9:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.
This is my last response but it is because of one word lawsuit. Not just against the people that detained but a lot of times against the employer when the employee gets hurt. I have two close friends that retired decades ago in their twenties because of fights they go into when they were cops because of back injuries. If it takes another hour to avoid getting physical then do it, do anything you can to avoid a physical confrontation. They only thing altercations do is make workman's comp and personal injury lawyers more money.
karl61 wrote:No - that is what a city police officer in Los Angeles or Orange County says when he is sent to a call and can' locate the parties.
So it has no bearing on the comment to which you were responding, namely that the police expect professional security personnel not to do that to them.
karl61 wrote:No - that is what a city police officer in Los Angeles or Orange County says when he is sent to a call and can' locate the parties.
So it has no bearing on the comment to which you were responding, namely that the police expect professional security personnel not to do that to them.
People leave all the time. That's what a description of the suspect(s) is for.
karl61 wrote:This is my last response but it is because of one word lawsuit. Not just against the people that detained but a lot of times against the employer when the employee gets hurt. I have two close friends that retired decades ago in their twenties because of fights they go into when they were cops because of back injuries. If it takes another hour to avoid getting physical then do it, do anything you can to avoid a physical confrontation. They only thing altercations do is make workman's comp and personal injury lawyers more money.
Of course shouting profanities on Temple Square is not something Church security personnel should be expected to allow to go on indefinitely. You're appealing to anecdotal evidence and refusing to recognize that the details of this situation mitigate your reductive perspective.