To what extent are TBM/Apologist tastes Brethren-directed?

[_Gadianton]

Hi Mak,

I wondered if you'd go the apologetic route to come up with a definition of higher culture that jettison's anything about culture in conflict with dictates from the Brethren. And it looks like that's what you've done. But your response is conflicted and unbelievable. You see, my young friend, they sip Absinthe in Bratislava yet, in spite of your baptism into the Church. They didn't sing the national anthem in Germany prior to your baptism. The crux of your argument that might excape you is that there are higher and lower elements of all cultures but what you've missed in your own argument is that the base or relinquished aspects of culture are defined by the culture, not by what's convenient to your baptism into Mormonism.

It's easier to get away with staring at The Kiss looking for just the right angle than it is to stare at Judith... with bishop standing behind you.

I believe you are cultured Mak, primarily because you presumably had many of these experiences prior to joining the church. But I think your culture is probably in decline now that you are a member of the Church, and that as an apologist the decline might accelerate.

[_maklelan]

DCP
Switzerdeutsch is a perfectly legitimate spelling. So are Schweizerdeutsch, Schwyzerdütsch, Schwiizerdütsch, Schwizertitsch, and Schwyzertütsch. You shouldn't let Google do your arguing for you if you don't know what you're talking about.

Switzerdeutsch is the most bonehead translation I've ever heard. I lived in Switzerland for six years, it can qualifiy for a Dumkopf American version.

It was me who said it, not DCP, and I used an American spelling intentionally. After all, if we use foreign spellings we get criticized for showing off:

There may be some, however, who objective to pedantic use of foreign terms by show-offy (albeit insecure) internet discussion board posters.

But no Swiss I know in German speaking Kanton's would call their German Deutsch.

The Germans certainly do, especially in Hamburg. That's the kinda the reason I called it what I did.

And Switzer is beyond stupid, I've never heard Switzer, even from the frequent Swiss travelers.
Do your homework before you express an opinion.

I've also been to Switzerland, and Austria, and Germany, and Denmark. I also speak the language, although not as much now as I do Spanish. I'll use the vernacular I want to use. Feel free not to approve all you want.

[_Eric]

I think that the TBM/Apologist expressed opinion that alcohol is simply meant to "dull the senses" only strengthens Dr. Robber's thesis. They appear to misunderstand the beautiful symphony that comes with a meal and an aptly paired, high quality beverage.

And yes, one only need reference the fine-dining landscape of Utah. I spent three weeks in downtown Salt Lake City earlier this summer eating and drinking at the city's best restaurants. While they have some upscale, pricey places; Market Street, Christopher's, Spencer's -- nothing in Utah could really be considered high class or fine-dining.

[_gramps]

Mak wrote:

That's the kinda the reason I called it what I did.

Can we call you on your grammar if you are going to call others on their spelling? (edited to add ) Or is that acceptable in Provo these days?

[_Gadianton]

Seconding that I think it's weird that you equate alcohol consumption with being cultured. If dulling one's senses

This quote perfectly demonstrates just how "green jello" you are, Nehor. I don't equate "alcohol consumption" or "dulling one's senses" with being cultured. Expensive French restaurants, however, match wines to food. Honestly, Nehor, I'm not making this up. And your objections show how you interpret other cultures reductively through green-jello Mormon lenses when enjoying wine with a meal becomes mere "alcohol consumption" and "dulling one's senses". I could knock the high fat content of an expensive dish and argue that if one wants a lump of grease, they can just go to McDonalds. I could, using your logic, suggest that if you're going to stare at Judith.. all day, might as well just pick up a porn magazine from 7-11. Your comments here explain fantastically why you are not, nor ever will be cultured. It's not merely the motions you go through to mimick, but how you make your approach in the first place. Your argument here says it all, and helps my cause out a great deal, thank you.

[_Gadianton]

Scratch 1 or Scratch 2, after a pause: You guys got no culture. I seen In Bruges, and I drink Bordeaux. Look upon me, puny mortals, and weep.

Now you're just being silly, my friend. Hey, this thread is your chance. Criticisms of "showing off", the equivalent of cultural sophistry, have come from other threads where your cultural activities had nothing to do whatsoever with the subject. I won't slight you or Mak at all for dropping names or locations here, that's the purpose of this thread.

Just so you know, your above quote deconstructs your own historic position. If someone's hobby is posting online, that doesn't make them culturally inferior to you just because you watch plays 24/7. Just as your inability to properly appreciate many meals doesn't make you automatically culturally inferior to a random poster on this board.

It is a valid question, to what extent do media such as the internet and popular entertainment work agaisnt higher culture? But it's also a valid question, to what extent do the commands of the Brethren work against culture?

[_maklelan]

Hi Mak,

I wondered if you'd go the apologetic route to come up with a definition of higher culture that jettison's anything about culture in conflict with dictates from the Brethren.

A poor attempt at damage control.

And it looks like that's what you've done. But your response is conflicted and unbelievable. You see, my young friend, they sip Absinthe in Bratislava yet, in spite of your baptism into the Church. They didn't sing the national anthem in Germany prior to your baptism.

And the date of my baptism has nothing to do with why I made those statements.

The crux of your argument that might excape you is that there are higher and lower elements of all cultures but what you've missed in your own argument is that the base or relinquished aspects of culture are defined by the culture, not by what's convenient to your baptism into Mormonism.

You don't seem to have read or comprehended the part of my post where I state that getting to know what the individuals feel defines their culture to them is how you understand culture.

It's easier to get away with staring at The Kiss looking for just the right angle than it is to stare at Judith... with bishop standing behind you.

Meaningless.

I believe you are cultured Mak, primarily because you presumably had many of these experiences prior to joining the church. But I think your culture is probably in decline now that you are a member of the Church, and that as an apologist the decline might accelerate.

Actually it's quite the opposite. My appreciation of, and experiences with, other cultures has only increased since joining the church, and it will only continue to increase. I'll be living on a 16th century English manor outside of Oxford for the next year. I'll be spending next Easter in Italy and next summer in Scotland getting some of my clan's tartan for my uncles. I'll also be playing golf at St. Andrews (and Turnberry if I can get on). You make a poor argument and you make an even poorer defense of that argument. You're clearly in no position to lecture me about being cultured.

[_Yoda]

Is this thread only limited to lack of food pairings based on the Word of Wisdom restriction on wine, or is the OP about all different aspects of culture?

The reason I ask is that no one has seen fit to comment on my example regarding Musical Theater. Just curious.

by the way, I only have an audio of our performance, but I can give you an example of the blocking we used.

Here is the audio from our performance:

http://web.me.com/escottmusicstudio/Sco ... mance.html

Here is the blocking of the original performance from YouTube, which we closely followed. I'm sorry that I couldn't get a video of our performance.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hr7mu5RU ... re=related

My point is.....the sketch is pretty racy...and yet I have not been branded as some heathen who shouldn't be teaching voice to the bishop's daughter because of the performance, which was done in my home, with her parent present.

[_maklelan]

I think that the TBM/Apologist expressed opinion that alcohol is simply meant to "dull the senses" only strengthens Dr. Robber's thesis. They appear to misunderstand the beautiful symphony that comes with a meal and an aptly paired, high quality beverage.

I understand it quite well. I was a wine host for two years in Dallas. I also don't miss it (I miss smoking more than wine pairing and liqueur). I also know that's not what makes someone cultured.

And yes, one only need reference the fine-dining landscape of Utah. I spent three weeks in downtown Salt Lake City earlier this summer eating and drinking at the city's best restaurants. While they have some upscale, pricey places; Market Street, Christopher's, Spencer's -- nothing in Utah could really be considered high class or fine-dining.

No significant disagreement there.

[_maklelan]

Can we call you on your grammar if you are going to call others on their spelling? (edited to add ) Or is that acceptable in Provo these days?

In an OP about how cultured a person is in comparison to the Mormons they should not grievously misspell "restaurant." You're free to correct my grammar all you want, but I don't know what Provo has to do with anything, unless you think you're being clever by looking at the "Location" part of of my account.