Gay Marriage and Abused Children

[_Gazelam]

Jersey,

I described to you and others the life course of children housed in Russia/Romania, how and why they were taken into the system, the conditions that they are subjected to and under what conditions they leave.

NONE of this has to do with sexual deviancy or loss of chastity!

Read my post again and try to stay with me!

Under what circumstances did all of these children get placed into such a horrific state of being? We arent talking about one, we're talking about thousands. A community that has sunk into sexual deviancy created the state those children were in.

[_Jersey Girl]

Jersey, Liz and Dancer,
I obviously didn't make my point clear. I do not say that the children Jersey is discussing in any way deserve their condition. that's ridiculous.

What I am talking about is the root of the problem, the cause of these children being in the state they are in. These poor children are the byproduct and symptom of moral decay in a society. Its a society cripled under the weight of crime, alcoholism and prostitution. These kids obviouly were not born into loving households with parents who loved one another and looked forward to having children. These kids are the byproduct of sex for the sake of satisfying an urge, a desire for pleasure as opposed to happiness.

Homosexuality is a sexual deviancy. A fetish, an obssesive disorder. As we accept it we embrace the disorder and empathy towards a sickness. We slide further into depravity and direct ourselves to the social ills of that russian system that produces those children.

I'm going to go off on you entirely now.

The root causes of the children being placed in foreign orphanages that I described, that td referred to, that Liz posted a study about...

ARE SPECIAL NEEDS CHILDREN.

They are children who are deaf, have vision impairments, learning disorders, cleft palate, clubbed foot, FAS who are labeled as mentally retarded or mentally ill and live their early lives in government sponsored systems of neglect, then turned out on the streets with no life chances to speak of!

This has nothing whatsoever to do with freaking moral depravity!

Even though you are in error, you are discussing their ORIGINS while td and others are discussing SOLUTIONS.

Is SEX all that you are prepared to discuss?

[_Jersey Girl]

Under what circumstances did all of these children get placed into such a horrific state of being? We aren't talking about one, we're talking about thousands. A community that has sunk into sexual deviancy created the state those children were in.

I have already addressed that in the lengthy post to which you responded.

READ IT!

You bet we're talking about thousands and it has nothing whatsoever to do with sex!

[_Gazelam]

Jersey,

Are you saying that organized crime, alcoholism and prostitution aren't rampant in the US?

Not at the level or depth or degree of social acceptance that it is in Russia. These poor people grew up in a religiously oppressed society that relied on a black market for everyday goods.

[_Jersey Girl]

Somebody please peel me off the ceiling. No really!

[_Paul Osborne]

Somebody please peel me off the ceiling. No really!

I'll peel you off the ceiling if you squeeze my lemon, babe!

Paul O

[_Paul Osborne]

Is SEX all that you are prepared to discuss?

Yes, let's discuss sex. We can have a group discussion and play show and tell down on the telestial board. Just leave your clothes here on the terrestrial board before going down.

Paul O

[_Gazelam]

Jersey,
Its more than handicapped kids...

The BBC's Richard Sargent in Moscow reports on a new scheme to give Russian orphans internships in large companies, allowing them the chance to avoid a life of crime, drug addiction and low-paid work.

Sergei proudly tries on a suit and tie for the first time, He has known a life that few of us could even contemplate. His father died in a car crash when he was three. And then his mother hit the bottle.

Sergei's habitual smile disappears and he lowers his gaze as he re-visits a time he has strived to forget.

"I don't want to remember; I have only bad memories from then," he says.

After five years of neglect and regular beatings, he and his two brothers were taken away from their mother. He never knew any other relatives and lost contact with his siblings, who were too old to be placed in an orphanage. He refuses to have any contact with his mother.

"But my dad was a very, very kind man," he says.

Bullying

It was a new start for the eight-year-old, a new life. A friend, Nikolai, describes the orphanage as a place without love, without warmth. But it was better than "home" for Sergei.

Life in a Russian orphanage depends greatly on its staff. Most are working there as a last resort. Bullying by older children is widespread and the over-stretched and under-paid staff simply do not have the time, and often the inclination, to give individual love and attention.

Orphans in Russia must leave orphanages at the age of 17. In Moscow , orphan "graduates" should by law be provided with a flat and a small stipend. But many of the 700,000 orphans in Russia are unprepared for life on the outside. Forty per cent of orphan graduates turn to crime, 40% become drug addicts and 10% commit suicide or simply "disappear" within the first year of independence, according to the Russian NGO, Big Changes. Only 2% enter university, compared with 45% of children raised in families.

Sergei is highly intelligent and motivated. Alongside his regular studies he has been coming to Women and Children First, a Russian NGO which teaches orphans "life-skills" to cope with life outside an institutionalized orphanage. His favourite class is English.

link

[_Jersey Girl]

Jersey,
Its more than handicapped kids...

The BBC's Richard Sargent in Moscow reports on a new scheme to give Russian orphans internships in large companies, allowing them the chance to avoid a life of crime, drug addiction and low-paid work.

Sergei proudly tries on a suit and tie for the first time, He has known a life that few of us could even contemplate. His father died in a car crash when he was three. And then his mother hit the bottle.

Sergei's habitual smile disappears and he lowers his gaze as he re-visits a time he has strived to forget.

"I don't want to remember; I have only bad memories from then," he says.

After five years of neglect and regular beatings, he and his two brothers were taken away from their mother. He never knew any other relatives and lost contact with his siblings, who were too old to be placed in an orphanage. He refuses to have any contact with his mother.

"But my dad was a very, very kind man," he says.

Bullying

It was a new start for the eight-year-old, a new life. A friend, Nikolai, describes the orphanage as a place without love, without warmth. But it was better than "home" for Sergei.

Life in a Russian orphanage depends greatly on its staff. Most are working there as a last resort. Bullying by older children is widespread and the over-stretched and under-paid staff simply do not have the time, and often the inclination, to give individual love and attention.

Orphans in Russia must leave orphanages at the age of 17. In Moscow , orphan "graduates" should by law be provided with a flat and a small stipend. But many of the 700,000 orphans in Russia are unprepared for life on the outside. Forty per cent of orphan graduates turn to crime, 40% become drug addicts and 10% commit suicide or simply "disappear" within the first year of independence, according to the Russian NGO, Big Changes. Only 2% enter university, compared with 45% of children raised in families.

Sergei is highly intelligent and motivated. Alongside his regular studies he has been coming to Women and Children First, a Russian NGO which teaches orphans "life-skills" to cope with life outside an institutionalized orphanage. His favourite class is English.

link

WE are talking about special needs children, children who are abused (as in your story) who are in need of a loving home.

Your story above, makes the point!


The children who we are talking about didn't enter the orphanages on account of sexual depravity. They **COME OUT** of the orphanages into a life of depravity, poverty, addiction to live on the streets.

Are you saying that you think the children that I have described, that td has described and those described in the above story would NOT be better off living in the home of a loving gay couple?

If you are saying that, tell me how you think they are better off in the orphanges or on the street.

Here are your only two choices as per these current exchanges:

1. Home of a loving gay couple.
2. In orphanges, on the street.

Which is the best choice for the child?

[_truth dancer]

OMG...

What I am talking about is the root of the problem, the cause of these children being in the state they are in. These poor children are the byproduct and symptom of moral decay in a society. Its a society cripled under the weight of crime, alcoholism and prostitution. These kids obviouly were not born into loving households with parents who loved one another and looked forward to having children. These kids are the byproduct of sex for the sake of satisfying an urge, a desire for pleasure as opposed to happiness.

UNBELIEVABLE! (sort of).

First, there are plenty of "normal" heterosexual, religious couples who have children with special needs who give them over to social services because they don't want them, (Yes, even here in the US). Secondly, there are plenty of couples, EVEN IN THE LDS CHURCH who abuse and neglect their children. (Have you looked at the stats in Utah). When I was at BYU I did a pretty intensive look at child abuse in Utah and the picture is not pretty. Third, millions of children, who would otherwise be completely "normal," develop all sorts of challenges DUE TO THE FACT THEY DON'T HAVE A NORMAL CHILDHOOD. Children abused, neglected, and raised without food, attention, play, care, and love develop disorders that are frankly often very difficult to heal. Finally, I don't give a &%$# why children are in need of a home... THEY DIDN'T DO ANYTHING WRONG. They need help, they need a home, they need families.

Again, please tell me how two women raising children is hurtful, damaging, or abusive.

Again, please demonstrate how the church and its members spending hundreds of millions of dollars to stop gay/lesbian marriage impacts these children in any way whatsoever.

And, again, I find is beyond sickening that some people believe it is better for children to be housed in an orphanage or on the streets than in a loving home with adults who cherish and adore them.

It astounds me to no end.