A Mesoamerican Scholar Discusses The Three Nephites.

[_Ray A]

Some of you may remember “Hashbaz” on MAD, who challenged beastie on some of the Mayan archaeology threads. Here is a bio (second from last) of “Hashbaz” from FAIR:

Mark Alan Wright was born and raised in Long Beach, California. He served his mission in Colombia from 1991 to 1993. He earned his BA in Anthropology at UCLA, where he graduated with both departmental and Latin honors (cum laude) and had the privilege of being the student commencement speaker. He earned his MA at UC Riverside in 2004, also in anthropology. He is currently a doctoral candidate in the Department of Anthropology at UC Riverside and is in the process of polishing his dissertation (both he and his lovely wife, Traci, hope he will finish soon). His research specialization is Mesoamerican Archaeology, and his dissertation focuses specifically on the institution of divine kingship among the ancient Maya civilization. Mark has been named a Nibley Fellow the past five years by FARMS. Before moving to Utah, he was an Associate Professor at Mt. San Jacinto College and taught early-morning seminary for seven years. He has been teaching Book of Mormon part-time in the Department of Ancient Scripture at BYU since the Fall of 2007, and he is currently a lead director for Liahona Guided Tours.

He did mention on MAD that he was working towards a Ph.D, and somewhat regretted the time he was spending posting there. Like most of us addicts, he’s apparently unable to control the impulse to post. Here is his latest offering in sterling TBM logic.The Nephite Twelve Disciples Were they all translated at one point?.

At the end of the first day when Christ visits the Nephites he touches all 12 of his disciples (3 Nephi 18:36). A couple of days later as he's about to ascend into heaven, he touches all of his disciples except those three who desired to tarry like John (3 Nephi 28:12). Could it be that all 12 were translated when he touched them the first time and he undid it for the nine when he touched them the second time?

I'm aware that 3 Nephi 18:37 states that Christ spoke to them as he touched them and said he had given them the power to give the Holy Ghost (although the multitude didn't hear what was said - what he actually said was based on later testimony by the disciples themselves), but is it possible that there was more to it than that?

I’m hazarding a guess this won’t be mentioned in his doctoral dissertation.


.

[_Uncle Dale]

...
I’m hazarding a guess this won’t be mentioned in his doctoral dissertation.
...

Oh why not? I'd be pleased as punch is the fellow would devote an entire
chapter to Ammon's hacking off the dull-witted clubsmen's arms, as being the
origin of cenote human sacrifices in the classical period.

Zarahemla is just two more inches down below Palenque -- they stopped
excavating a day too soon!!!!!!!

UD

[_bcspace]

I’m hazarding a guess this won’t be mentioned in his doctoral dissertation.

What does Christ touching the 12 disciples have to do with archeology?

[_Ray A]

What does Christ touching the 12 disciples have to do with archeology?

Because many apologists (who have degrees) are driven by faith more than scholarship (especially where they have vested belief interests). That he would actually believe this nonsense is not a good indication of where he's going, no matter how respected in the field he is (see Coe on the different kinds of Mormon archaeologists). He came on to MAD boasting about all that he read, all that he wrote, and his pursing a Ph.D, to basically "out-degree" beastie. Frankly, I'd trust someone who's read less and has no degrees in the field but can still be considered educated enough to inform those less familiar with the subject, on a more rational level.

It's (his case) sort of like an astronaut who believes the moon is made of Swiss cheese. The mythology penetrates too deeply as "fact", and that it inflitrates his thinking to this degree must be a worry to some.

[_harmony]

Mark Alan Wright was born and raised in Long Beach, California. He served his mission in Colombia from 1991 to 1993. He earned his BA in Anthropology at UCLA, where he graduated with both departmental and Latin honors (cum laude) and had the privilege of being the student commencement speaker. He earned his MA at UC Riverside in 2004, also in anthropology. He is currently a doctoral candidate in the Department of Anthropology at UC Riverside and is in the process of polishing his dissertation (both he and his lovely wife, Traci, hope he will finish soon). His research specialization is Mesoamerican Archaeology, and his dissertation focuses specifically on the institution of divine kingship among the ancient Maya civilization. Mark has been named a Nibley Fellow the past five years by FARMS. Before moving to Utah, he was an Associate Professor at Mt. San Jacinto College and taught early-morning seminary for seven years. He has been teaching Book of Mormon part-time in the Department of Ancient Scripture at BYU since the Fall of 2007, and he is currently a lead director for Liahona Guided Tours.

Oh please. No self respecting anthropologist would be a tour director for a travel company.

From the Liahona Guided Tours website:

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What the heck is he thinking, to align himself with such drivel?

[_MCB]

I'd be pleased as punch if the fellow would devote an entire
chapter to Ammon's hacking off the dull-witted clubsmen's arms, as being the
origin of cenote human sacrifices in the classical period.

Zarahemla is just two more inches down below Palenque -- they stopped
excavating a day too soon!!!!!!!

LOL!!! Still excavating through Clavigero. Maybe it was a mistranslation-- ears for arms???

[_Uncle Dale]

...
Maybe it was a mistranslation-- ears for arms???

What "unfaithful" archaeologists fail to realize, is that reading the Book of
Mormon will solve their cultural sequencing difficulties throughout all of
ancient Latin America.

The story of Ammon hacking off the lined-up clubmen's limbs records an
actual event in Meso-American prehistory, when the macuahuitl was
first introduced from the north, by invading Tehuaticanistas, who had
inserted "Toltec steel" (obsidian) into their clubs.

That is why Ammon's steel sword (obsidian-augmented club) prevailed
over the Maya's more primitive weapons, with no volcanic glass inserts.



It's ALL there in the Book of Mormon!! We can throw away all of the
archaeologists' so-called "reporting." They are aligned with Satan, in
attempting to destroy the latter day work --- it is soooo obvious!!!

UD

[_MCB]

ROFLMAO!!!!

So obvious no-one has ever tried to explain it.

Josephus himself would roll over in his grave. LOL Only one step from that and KJE

[_Danna]

Steel or not, those macuahuitls look nasty.

Time for Mormon Myth-Busters to get to work! Line up several (expired) pigs and see how easy it is to lop off the legs with a macuahuitl.

[_Uncle Dale]

Steel or not, those macuahuitls look nasty.

Time for Mormon Myth-Busters to get to work! Line up several (expired) pigs and see how easy it is to lop off the legs with a macuahuitl.

As I recall, the obsidian holds up fairly well in cutting
through flesh -- but is only good for a bone or two
before it loses its cutting edge.

Ammon could have lopped off two or three arms, maybe.
How many is he credited with? A couple of hundred?



And not one of the lined-up clubmen thought to simply
throw his club at Ammon, and knock him down?

Sheeeeesh!

UD