Joseph's Laced Wine

[Guest]

I have been wondering lately about the angelic visions during the dedication of the Kirkland temple.
It seems pretty obvious to me that they were drunken hallucinations.
I have come to this conclusion based on the fact that they drank "special" wine prepared by Joseph after fasting for long periods of time and were sleep deprived. Another big piece of evidence for me is the fact that these visions stopped at exactly the same time Joseph died and did not have his finest wine to share.
For all you hallucinogenic drug experts out there, what are the possible additives Joseph used in his finest wine?

[_Willy Law]

This from i4m.com
http://www.i4m.com/think/history/holy-ghost.htm

It now appears that spiritual power comparable to that of Joseph Smith can be acquired in the course of consuming visionary plants, mushrooms and cactus. Otherwise known as psychedelics and hallucinogens, when these visionary materials are taken in a religious setting, they are often referred to as entheogens. An entheogen is any substance, such as a plant or drug, taken to occasion a heavenly vision or spiritual rapture.

How important are entheogens to the world’s great religions? Robert C. Fuller, a leading historian and interpreter of American religious life writes that the use of entheogens

… is one of the most mysterious and important subjects in all religious history. Entheogens have figured prominently in the mystical practice of some of the world’s greatest civilizations. They have been widely employed4 in shamanic society and their use continues today throughout the world. They alter consciousness in such a profound way, that … their effects can range from states resembling psychosis to what are perhaps the ultimate human experiences, union with god or revelations of other mystical realities. (Robert C. Fuller. Stairways to Heaven: Drugs in American Religious History. Boulder, Colo.: Westview. 2000. as quoted in Stephen Hoeller, Misca-06)

[_Joseph]

A bit off but what wine did Joseph and buddies drink the night before the killings in Carthage jail?

[_MCB]

I don't know, but given how he began the Follett Discourse talking about religious fraud, and directed what he said to Sidney Rigdon, he had to have been imbibing. I am just wondering if that night, 156 years ago, people might have been listening to their conversation. Secrets told under the disinhibiting influence of alcohol could have been very revealing. Maybe triggered the whole thing.

[_Willy Law]

So I have been reading some more about this and it really makes things come together for me. Virtually every account of people having visions is preceded by their account of either taking sacramental wine or being consecrated with oil (which can also be laced and absorbed in the skin).
Joseph's first vision accounts also closely mirror other religious accounts when people are under the influence of hallucinogenics.
The two most likely hallucinogenics used are Dantra and the Amanita Muscaria Mushroom. Both found in upstate NY and Joseph was familiar with both since two open practitioners were among his gold digging buddies and first converts to the church.
Also fits that Joseph would specifically include wine of "your own making" in the word of wisdom. How else could he get congregations to see visions if they could no longer drink his laced wine. Proof of this is evident since nobody has had a similar vision since Joseph's death. He obviously did not school Brigham in the art of being a "visionary".
Come on, someone in this crowd has to have some first hand knowledge of these kind of drugs.
Anyone?
Anyone?
Bueller?

[_Trevor]

Willy,

You might be interested in Robert Beckstead's Sunstone presentation on entheogens and Joseph Smith from a couple of years back. Bob is a really interesting fellow; he and I are interested in similar things. I think there is suggestive evidence that this kind of thing may have been going on. Certainly the case is not strong enough to affirm that it must have happened.

[_Trevor]

Come on, someone in this crowd has to have some first hand knowledge of these kind of drugs.
Anyone?
Anyone?
Bueller?

One of our recently departed (not in the "from mortality" sense), Ezias, did have experience with such substances, If I recall correctly.

[_Jeneum]

There was recently a Gnostic Media podcast about this very subject. Although it is riddled with a few obvious errors, it is still a pretty good listen.
http://gnosticmedia.podomatic.com/entry/2010-05-31T13_14_58-07_00

[_Willy Law]

Willy,

You might be interested in Robert Beckstead's Sunstone presentation on entheogens and Joseph Smith from a couple of years back. Bob is a really interesting fellow; he and I are interested in similar things. I think there is suggestive evidence that this kind of thing may have been going on. Certainly the case is not strong enough to affirm that it must have happened.

Thanks Trevor. Found the MP3 for the presentation here:

https://www.sunstonemagazine.com/shop/products/symposium-sessions-2/the-restoration-and-the-sacred-mushroom-did-joseph-smith-use-psychedelics-to-facilitate-his-visionary-experiences/

I'll listen to it this week.

[_zeezrom]

I agree with your conclusions, Willie. Yeah, we need Ezias to speak up.