KEP Dictation Argument: The Evidence

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_William Schryver
_Emeritus
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Re: KEP Dictation Argument: The Evidence

Post by _William Schryver »

Oh, Cracker, you make me laugh so much!

Since neither Metcalfe, Smith, nor Ashment are willing to publicly debate me on the topic of The Meaning and Purpose of the Kirtland Egyptian Papers, what I really wish is that you were in a position to do it. Granted, it would resemble the USA vs. Angola basketball game back in 1992, but it would still be fun, in a merciless kind of way, to watch you perform a classic Graham meltdown in front of a crowd of stunned people. Still, consider the invitation open. Should you ever make your way out to Utah for a Sunstone or FAIR conference, and assuming none of the "Big Three" change their minds in the meantime, we'll have to arrange for just such an event to take place. I know I'd feel guilty afterwards, kind of like when I punched the mentally disabled kid in 7th grade (he was being rude to a girl waiting for the bus), but I'll do penance of some sort to make up for it.

Incidentally, why do you know anything about Ed Ashment being contacted by MI when such communication was kept confidential?

Contacted him about what?
... every man walketh in his own way, and after the image of his own god, whose image is in the likeness of the world, and whose substance is that of an idol ...
_William Schryver
_Emeritus
Posts: 1671
Joined: Wed Nov 01, 2006 3:58 pm

Re: KEP Dictation Argument: The Evidence

Post by _William Schryver »

thews wrote:
wenglund wrote:Just a brief note to say that even though I have decided to leave this board for a while (for reasons already expressed), I have appreciated some of the discussion that has taken place here, and I have decided to continue with that discussion here:

http://www.mormonapologetics.org/topic/ ... 1208908187

Those who are willing and able, and who wish to keep the discussion at least somewhat civil and reasonable, are welcome to join me there.

Thanks, -Wade Englund-

Wade,

Are you actually interested in the truth, or are you just seeking out people to agree with you? If you felt your arguments had a valid point to make, you'd make them in here, as the mods won't control the discussion and the major players aren't banned. Having your discussion on MADB where the mods micro manage the conversation and only people allowed to contribute is really just patting yourself on the back. Your arguments don't hold weight and it's why you need this safe haven away from opinion that doesn't agree with you.

None of the "major players" are banned from the MADB board. Never have been.
... every man walketh in his own way, and after the image of his own god, whose image is in the likeness of the world, and whose substance is that of an idol ...
_thews
_Emeritus
Posts: 3053
Joined: Sun Oct 25, 2009 2:26 pm

Re: KEP Dictation Argument: The Evidence

Post by _thews »

William Schryver wrote:None of the "major players" are banned from the MADB board. Never have been.

So Kevin can post there? I know I can't, and I also know that what one does post can get them banned if the mods think the truth is getting too close or one of their major players (like you) has been cornered and needs some help.
2 Tim 4:3 For the time will come when men will not put up with sound doctrine.
2 Tim 4:4 They will turn their ears away from the truth & turn aside to myths
_Kevin Graham
_Emeritus
Posts: 13037
Joined: Fri Oct 27, 2006 6:44 pm

Re: KEP Dictation Argument: The Evidence

Post by _Kevin Graham »

William, you've been busted already. The bomb went off and there is nothing to diffuse, but only you are too stupid to realize it. I've tried to debate you here for YEARS. You've been running from me ever since I called you out for sending me an email requesting an interview, while also saying you'd never believe any of this apologetic nonsense if you were an outsider who wasn't controlled by a testimony. You're an intellectual fraud with a need to feed an ego whose thirst can never be quenched. You have no intention of debating anyone, especially me! Because you know my first twenty minutes of time would be dedicated to an exposition of your history of failed arguments, your deceptive maneuvers, and your flat out lies which you have repeatedly shown no intention of responding to. I would essentially let the world see the real William Schryver.

Why the hell would you put yourself in such a position? You would only debate me with a set of guidelines that require us to talk about your idiotic cipher theory, not an open discussion about the KEP.

You wouldn't debate me without being able to rig the debate from the start, and you know it. Besides, in my first encounter with you I would have to test the extent of your "legendary" (given your frequent bravado to that effect) virility. I am very anxious to find out if you're half the man that you pretend to be when your critics aren't standing in your face. Now I have no doubt you'd probably insult the women here in public as you do online, but I'm highly skeptical of your manhood in the face of better men who are willing to call your bluff. I intend to say to your face, everything you've said to others online, but have been too afraid to say to their faces.


You want to debate me!

ROFL!

You're a coward Will.
_Darth J
_Emeritus
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Joined: Thu May 13, 2010 12:16 am

Re: KEP Dictation Argument: The Evidence

Post by _Darth J »

Image

"I just want to remind everyone again that I really don't care about this insignificant message board that nobody reads. I'll come by several times a day so that you don't forget that I really, really, really don't care about what any of you people think. My sig line here and on MADB is proof that I don't care what anyone here says. So just remember, I don't care about this message board, and neither does anyone else, and I don't even look at it or pay attention to it. I'll be back later to tell you again how much I don't care and that I don't pay attention, since I wasn't trying to prove anything to any of you, anyway. I just want to make it perfectly clear that I don't care what you say. So I don't care, and you just remember that until I come back to tell you again."
_Kevin Graham
_Emeritus
Posts: 13037
Joined: Fri Oct 27, 2006 6:44 pm

Re: KEP Dictation Argument: The Evidence

Post by _Kevin Graham »

So Kevin can post there?

LOL.

Haven't you been paying attention? I'm not a "major player" according to Wilbur the Coward. He has come to this forum for three years now saying that I'm upset that I've been "rendered irrelevant to the debate," etc etc as if this somehow hurts my feelings. He was only projecting, confusing me with someone who was only interested in the KEP to make a name for himself .(like WIlbur) Now what in the hell have I done in the past five years that would ever make anyone think that? I've published nothing nor have I ever tried to. I essentially dropped the subject after the 2006 FAIR conference because we were told Hauglid and Metcalfe were about to publish their work. It was clear to me that little else needed to be said until someone actually pubslihed something. I've been lured back into the internet "discussion" only because Will has chosen to posture himself as an expert who has single-handedly "refuted forty years" of arguments, and he regularly dragged my name up. If it weren't for Will, I doubt I would have even bothered to get back into this subject since 2006. By contrast, Will, as an out of work Mr. Mom, has all the time in the world to formulate his apologetic riff raff, coy up to unsuspecting BYU scholars, deceive people in email requests, etc.

The fact is there is no debate nor has there been. Where is the debate? Will won't debate here and the suffocating environment at MADB makes any real debate virtually impossible. Every time BRent refutes something WIll says, he runs away and promises to come back with evidence in some other venue. So by what metric does Will insist he's a major player and yet I'm not? Not that I care, but it is hilarious that I am responsible for educating Will on the subject of the KEP, and a few years later he thinks that just because he's been given color photos under the table by some of the BYU asses he's been kissing so hard, and that he's willing to make a fool of himself at a FAIR conference, that this somehow makes him a "major player." Again, when I first raised the issue of the KEP as it relates to the Book of Abraham, WIll thought I was talking about the Joseph Smith Papyri, insisting we didn't have all that was at Joseph Smith's disposal. When I told him he obviously didn't know what the KEP were, he shot back arrogantly telling me and the world that he had "examined" the KEP as thoroughly as anyone ever had, again thinking the KEP = Joseph Smith Papyri. Had he known the KEP were hidden from the public, he never would have made such an asinine comment. But it goes and one of the MANY examples where William Schryver is willing to flat out lie to his audience if it thinks it will win him accolades.

Will Schryver is to the Book of Abraham, what Wells Jakeman was to the Book of Mormon, except Jakeman was actually a scholar, technically. Jakeman was able to get the attention of BYU scholars, market his nonsense in video format and get Mormons all over the world excited about his "conclusive finding" that the word "Nephi" appears on the "tree of life" stone. Virtually everyone in my mission knew about his presentation and you could buy the audio on cassette at any Church bookstore.

But when the dust is settled, and the audience expands far beyond the reach of testimony-bearing minions, FARMS was compelled to disown his scholarship as speculative nonsense or else lose credibility as well.
_William Schryver
_Emeritus
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Joined: Wed Nov 01, 2006 3:58 pm

Re: KEP Dictation Argument: The Evidence

Post by _William Schryver »

thews wrote:
William Schryver wrote:None of the "major players" are banned from the MADB board. Never have been.

So Kevin can post there? I know I can't, and I also know that what one does post can get them banned if the mods think the truth is getting too close or one of their major players (like you) has been cornered and needs some help.

Cracker Graham is only a major player in his twisted mind.
... every man walketh in his own way, and after the image of his own god, whose image is in the likeness of the world, and whose substance is that of an idol ...
_William Schryver
_Emeritus
Posts: 1671
Joined: Wed Nov 01, 2006 3:58 pm

Re: KEP Dictation Argument: The Evidence

Post by _William Schryver »

Kevin Graham wrote:William, you've been busted already. The bomb went off and there is nothing to diffuse, but only you are too stupid to realize it. I've tried to debate you here for YEARS. You've been running from me ever since I called you out for sending me an email requesting an interview, while also saying you'd never believe any of this apologetic nonsense if you were an outsider who wasn't controlled by a testimony. You're an intellectual fraud with a need to feed an ego whose thirst can never be quenched. You have no intention of debating anyone, especially me! Because you know my first twenty minutes of time would be dedicated to an exposition of your history of failed arguments, your deceptive maneuvers, and your flat out lies which you have repeatedly shown no intention of responding to. I would essentially let the world see the real William Schryver.

Why the hell would you put yourself in such a position? You would only debate me with a set of guidelines that require us to talk about your idiotic cipher theory, not an open discussion about the KEP.

You wouldn't debate me without being able to rig the debate from the start, and you know it. Besides, in my first encounter with you I would have to test the extent of your "legendary" (given your frequent bravado to that effect) virility. I am very anxious to find out if you're half the man that you pretend to be when your critics aren't standing in your face. Now I have no doubt you'd probably insult the women here in public as you do online, but I'm highly skeptical of your manhood in the face of better men who are willing to call your bluff. I intend to say to your face, everything you've said to others online, but have been too afraid to say to their faces.


You want to debate me!

ROFL!

You're a coward Will.

So I guess that means no, you're not willing.

Well, I'm not surprised. None of your cohorts want to do it, either. Why should you stick your neck out if they're not willing to do so?
... every man walketh in his own way, and after the image of his own god, whose image is in the likeness of the world, and whose substance is that of an idol ...
_Kevin Graham
_Emeritus
Posts: 13037
Joined: Fri Oct 27, 2006 6:44 pm

Re: KEP Dictation Argument: The Evidence

Post by _Kevin Graham »

For Will, the only major players are LDS.

Chris Smith, according to Will, is just a "kid barely out of his puberty" who can't possibly add anything of value because he still "lives with his parents." Oh, and he is constantly described as someone who has chosen a career in anti-Mormonism!

Brent and Vogel were called "nutjobs" from day one by Wilbur. Brent was accused, regularly, of lying to his audience and being carteful not to show portions of the KEP that undermine his arguments. EVen though people like Bokovoy, Hauglid and other LDS scholars consider them to be most qualified and highly intelligent, for Will they are just anti-Mormons who do nothing more than serve to, as Nibley put it, "Keep us on our toes."

And we've seen just what Will thinks of Ed Ashment; someone who has published "virtually nothing" on the subject and a coward who is suffering from "andropause."

So don't for a second think Will has any respect for anyone who isn't on his side of things. Will admitted he is driven by testimony, not an intellectual analysis of evidence. As he once said too me in an email:

“…if I were an outsider looking in at all of this, I find it difficult to believe that I could be persuaded that the production of the Book of Abraham was anything other than a clumsy imposture perpetrated by Joseph Smith upon his followers. But, of course, I’m not. I came into the discussion already possessing a conviction that the Book of Abraham was divinely-inspired scripture. “
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_Darth J
_Emeritus
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Re: KEP Dictation Argument: The Evidence

Post by _Darth J »

Image

1. Given what has been established above, do you agree that William Schryver's emissaries have a cognitive disorder (not unlike two keys, or two locks, trying to unlock each other)?
2. If not, why not?
3. Given what has been established above, do you agree that trying to make the evidence fit the theory about this cipher idea is a cognitive disorder (not unlike a large key trying to unlock a small or undeveloped key, or a large key trying to unlock a small or undeveloped lock, or vice-versa)?
4. If not, why not?
5. Given what has been established above, do you agree that having someone who behaves like William Schryver be the champion of defending the restored gospel of Jesus Christ is a cognitive disorder (not unlike a house key trying to unlock a car)?
6. If not, why not?
7. Given what has been established above, do you agree that this KEP circus that ignores the elephant in the room is a cognitive disorder (not unlike a key trying to unlock a permanently broken or destroyed lock or key, or vice-versa)?
8. If not, why not?

http://web.archive.org/web/200412161737 ... nd/sad.htm
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