For Whyme: Why are you a Catholic?

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_EAllusion
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Re: For Whyme: Why are you a Catholic?

Post by _EAllusion »

The first Pope in the Bad Popes is more humorous than anything. Here's the Catholic Encyclopedia's entry on him:
Date of birth unknown; died about August, 897. Stephen was a Roman, and the son of John, a priest. He had been consecrated Bishop of Anagni, possibly against his will, by Formosus, and became pope about May, 896. Whether induced by evil passion or perhaps, more probably, compelled by the Emperor Lambert and his mother Ageltruda, he caused the body of Formosus to be exhumed, and in January, 897, to be placed before an unwilling synod of the Roman clergy. A deacon was appointed to answer for the deceased pontiff, who was condemned for performing the functions of a bishop when he had been deposed and for passing from the See of Porto to that of Rome. The corpse was then stripped of its sacred vestments, deprived of two fingers of its right hand, clad in the garb of a layman, and ultimately thrown into the Tiber. Fortunately it was not granted to Stephen to have time to do much else besides this atrocious deed. Before he was put to death by strangulation, he forced several of those who had been ordained by Formosus to resign their offices and he granted a few privileges to churches.


http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/14289d.htm

And that's the most positive spin I've seen of him. I like the "Fortunately, he was strangled to death pretty quickly..." line.

An 19th century artist's depiction of the trial:
Image

Let's face it. That's awesome.
_madeleine
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Re: For Whyme: Why are you a Catholic?

Post by _madeleine »

The center for Christians is Jesus Christ. The message of Christ Crucified is one for all of humanity, including the most hardened or deviant criminal.

The Protestant temptation is to declare that Jesus is no longer at the center. Perhaps this is based on how people act, but the true Christian understands, it is in our deepest depravity that we need Jesus Christ the most, and He remains at the center. The only solution is to turn to Him, as individuals, but more importantly, as a community.

In the words of someone I admire, who wrote an editorial response in an Italian newspaper: "Let us return, wounded, to Christ." As the Catholic understanding of sin is that our sin not only wounds ourselves, but the entire communion of the baptized, the Church. So we must, together, go through this purgation, and place our hope that at the end, God will have cleansed us by the fire of the Holy Spirit and the Redemption of His Blood.

To this end, the only way to purge ourselves of this filth is to bring it out from the darkness it has hidden for so long, and into the light. Many reforms have been made, and will continue to be adjusted. People who were/are abused must be able to come forward, and find healing. Their abusers must face justice.

So, articles like this, while painful and in the category of "still" and "not again", are invaluable in this process. The doors have to be opened, and the filth swept out, while we pray, "Look not on our sins but on the faith of Your Church. Have Mercy on us, Lord Jesus Christ".

So, whether it is bad popes, or abusive priests. These are wounds. Some very deep and slow to heal, but they are only made whole in and through Jesus Christ. There is no other Way. We must return, wounded, to Christ.

Peace.
Last edited by Guest on Sun May 29, 2011 8:45 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Being a Christian is not the result of an ethical choice or a lofty idea, but the encounter with an event, a person, which gives life a new horizon and a decisive direction -Pope Benedict XVI
_madeleine
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Re: For Whyme: Why are you a Catholic?

Post by _madeleine »

EAllusion wrote:
And that's the most positive spin I've seen of him. I like the "Fortunately, he was strangled to death pretty quickly..." line.


The common theme for Catholics when observing past or current sins of the Church or Her faithful, is that the Faith handed on by the Apostles remains protected, intact and unchanged.

The world focuses on sin. Catholics understand that all sin and fall short, including Popes and Priests. (The Pope has as confessor, just as all Catholics do.) We are not surprised by sin. Though, the depth of deprivation and criminality within a small fraction of the clergy is a blow, to us all.

Anyway, the fortune seen in the early death of a bad Pope is viewed as Providential. A judgement and action of God.

Peace.
Being a Christian is not the result of an ethical choice or a lofty idea, but the encounter with an event, a person, which gives life a new horizon and a decisive direction -Pope Benedict XVI
_lostindc
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Re: For Whyme: Why are you a Catholic?

Post by _lostindc »

I would love to hear answers to questions posed to Whyme.

Not sure why anyone wants to be part of a modern day pedo ring.
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_why me
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Re: For Whyme: Why are you a Catholic?

Post by _why me »

I was born catholic and so, it was the faith of my childhood and teenage years. I converted to Mormonism when I was in my late teens. I find good things in both faiths.

The child abuse problems of the catholic church and how the catholic church orginally responded to them was a terrible mistake made by leaders of the catholic church. And they need to accept their mistakes and the damage that their mistakes caused to thousands of people. However, the catholic church has millions and millions of members and to think that all the millions of people that are catholics will behave perfectly would be a mistake, including the priests. It has been always claimed by the catholic church that it is a extremely small minority of priests who engage in this behavior. And that is probably true.

For catholics who bash the Mormon church as they did on the catholic apologetic site need to come to terms with the catholic church's reputation and abuses throughout its history. For the exmormons who become catholic as some of the posters on the catholic apologetic site, they need to realize that by attacking their former faith as they do, the catholic church can also be attacked and disparaged because of its history and terrible mistakes.
I intend to lay a foundation that will revolutionize the whole world.
Joseph Smith


We are “to feed the hungry, to clothe the naked, to provide for the widow, to dry up the tear of the orphan, to comfort the afflicted, whether in this church, or in any other, or in no church at all…”
Joseph Smith
_Ceeboo
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Re: For Whyme: Why are you a Catholic?

Post by _Ceeboo »

Morning lostindc,

lostindc wrote:
Not sure why anyone wants to be part of a modern day pedo ring.


You should understand that we Catholics (at least the great majority of us) are pedophiles ourselves.

To have found a church (like I clearly have) that supports and encourages a "modern day pedo ring" is the cat's meow for millions of people just like me.

Peace,
Ceeboo
_Doctor CamNC4Me
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Re: For Whyme: Why are you a Catholic?

Post by _Doctor CamNC4Me »

why me wrote:I was born catholic and so, it was the faith of my childhood and teenage years. I converted to Mormonism when I was in my late teens. I find good things in both faiths.

The child abuse problems of the catholic church and how the catholic church orginally responded to them was a terrible mistake made by leaders of the catholic church. And they need to accept their mistakes and the damage that their mistakes caused to thousands of people. However, the catholic church has millions and millions of members and to think that all the millions of people that are catholics will behave perfectly would be a mistake, including the priests. It has been always claimed by the catholic church that it is a extremely small minority of priests who engage in this behavior. And that is probably true.

For catholics who bash the Mormon church as they did on the catholic apologetic site need to come to terms with the catholic church's reputation and abuses throughout its history. For the exmormons who become catholic as some of the posters on the catholic apologetic site, they need to realize that by attacking their former faith as they do, the catholic church can also be attacked and disparaged because of its history and terrible mistakes.


Hello Mr. Whyme,

How do you reconcile the truth claims made by both organizations?

Am I correct, then, in surmizing that the behavior of church leadership don't have any impact on the organization's truth claims?

V/R
Dr. Cam
In the face of madness, rationality has no power - Xiao Wang, US historiographer, 2287 AD.

Every record...falsified, every book rewritten...every statue...has been renamed or torn down, every date...altered...the process is continuing...minute by minute. History has stopped. Nothing exists except an endless present in which the Ideology is always right.
_Hoops
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Re: For Whyme: Why are you a Catholic?

Post by _Hoops »

Ceeboo wrote: I am Catholic because I believe that the Catholic Church is firmly rooted in Scripture, is the Church that the Lord had left us with and promised us would stand until the end.
Simply put, I am Catholic because I believe the Catholic Church represents the very base of Christianity.

Peace,
Ceeboo


An incredibly compelling answer, one for which I have no good response to my Catholic friends when they make it to me.
_Ceeboo
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Re: For Whyme: Why are you a Catholic?

Post by _Ceeboo »

Hey Hoops,

Hoops wrote:
An incredibly compelling answer, one for which I have no good response to my Catholic friends when they make it to me.


Thanks, Brother/Sister (?) (I found this answer, and then stole it, from the center of a fortune cookie many moons ago)

by the way: If I may ask, you are Evangelical, yes?


Peace,
Ceeboo
_why me
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Re: For Whyme: Why are you a Catholic?

Post by _why me »

Doctor CamNC4Me wrote:
Hello Mr. Whyme,

How do you reconcile the truth claims made by both organizations?

Am I correct, then, in surmizing that the behavior of church leadership don't have any impact on the organization's truth claims?

V/R
Dr. Cam


I have never concerned myself with such things. I think that they are a waste of time to doctrine bash and engage in one up man ship. I have seen it on the catholic site as they hammer their doctrine into the LDS who come there to defend their faith. Bottom line: God will not punish catholics for being catholic nor will he punish the LDS for being LDS. Faith and works apply to everyone of different faiths.

And yes, church leaders are just leaders with all their faults and mishaps. They are human beings who can make terrible mistakes as spirit beings on a human journey.
I intend to lay a foundation that will revolutionize the whole world.
Joseph Smith


We are “to feed the hungry, to clothe the naked, to provide for the widow, to dry up the tear of the orphan, to comfort the afflicted, whether in this church, or in any other, or in no church at all…”
Joseph Smith
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