Am I responsible for the "culture" of MormonDiscussions.com?

[_asbestosman]

Do you think it's inappropriate to quote people and criticize what they've said on an issue?

There is a difference between criticism and mockery. Some day you will see. Hopefully.

Even mockery has its place in my book (or at least satire). However, it does contribute to the culture of the board and much of the mockery does come across as petty.


I think Blixa makes an excellent point about some of the gems than be found here. Still, one often has to wade through a lot of muck. My favorite board was fairboards in the past. It had moderation which I appreciated while yet having many interesting discussions, humor, and characters. I pine for the good ol' days of fairboards. I had more fun there than I ever had here in large part due to the environment. I was reminded of that when I recently went through my PM box there. I've had fun here too, but not nearly as much. Maybe part of it is the rose-colored filter of memory, but I think there was something more to it--something special. Whether I was arguing with Lognormal about ID, quoting scripture, coming up with funny ideas along with Steuss, Morningstar, or Zakuska or even talking about swearing with cjcampbell I had a lot of fun.

[_Buffalo]

Do you think it's inappropriate to quote people and criticize what they've said on an issue?

If it's part of a discussion such that the audience is able to appreciate the context. ..then sure it's appropriate.

If you are referring to the thread pinned, the entire thread's context is to put quotes there which for the most part are meant to mock the thinking of the individual. The quotes are not given context and the person quoted is not even involved in the thread and likely to counter or respond. So how is the issue going to ever be discussed? So the intent is not to discuss any issue, it's to be critical of an an individual or their thoughts in a place they aren't even participating at.

A response at MDD certainly isn't possible for most here.

[_Buffalo]

Do you think it's inappropriate to quote people and criticize what they've said on an issue?

There is a difference between criticism and mockery. Some day you will see. Hopefully.

Even mockery has its place in my book (or at least satire). However, it does contribute to the culture of the board and much of the mockery does come across as petty.


I think Blixa makes an excellent point about some of the gems than be found here. Still, one often has to wade through a lot of muck. My favorite board was fairboards in the past. It had moderation which I appreciated while yet having many interesting discussions, humor, and characters. I pine for the good ol' days of fairboards. I had more fun there than I ever had here in large part due to the environment. I was reminded of that when I recently went through my PM box there. I've had fun here too, but not nearly as much. Maybe part of it is the rose-colored filter of memory, but I think there was something more to it--something special. Whether I was arguing with Lognormal about ID, quoting scripture, coming up with funny ideas along with Steuss, Morningstar, or Zakuska or even talking about swearing with cjcampbell I had a lot of fun.

Can you point out examples of comments here that are inappropriate or cross some line?

viewtopic.php?f=1&t=13319&start=378

[Anonymous]

Regarding culture of this board, why for example is a thread meant to mock participants on another board pinned to the top in Terrestial? That affects the culture. What does that have to do with issues in Mormonism? By pinning that... what is it meant to accomplish? in my opinion ...it makes this board look petty minded. But that is a decision by Shade and it affects the culture here.

Gotta say that's a decent point. Hadn't noticed that was pinned...

Ren, most of us can't reply to any posts on MDD and the thread in question is partly in response to that. I've contributed to that thread when I have read arguments devoid of logic and grammar, but also arguments so completely ignorant and lacking in historical knowledge that they boggle the mind. I see it as an equivalent of the blog "crap My Students Write": a place to chronicle the sad state of american education.

I can imagine various posters are embarrassed to see some of their mistakes reposted. But I am also sure that some of them are absolutely proud of the distorted ways they understand race and gender. Remember, MDD is the latest iteration of a board where posters were happy to proclaim garbage like this about the Mountain Meadows Massacre:

What is the hang-up with killing women and children in this instance? I personally think if once all the men were dead killing the rest was the most humane thing to do. What are the alternatives. Leave a wagon train of women and children to fend for themselves to continue on or return to Missouri? Take the women in as additional polygamus wives?

Abandoning the women and children would surely lead to their death. And taking all the women for wives would reflect more negatively today on this board.

Yes this was a tragic event, but we live in a totally different world today, and judging the thoughts and feelings of these people that led to these events, by our current modern standards is judging in ignorance.

(Speaking of "judging in ignorance," the Fancher/Baker party were from Arkansas.)

The above post is one of the most vile things I have ever encountered, not only at FAIR/MAD/MDD but just about anywhere online. And indecent as it is, I never once took it as indicative of the general tenor of the board, or reflecting a mentality all posters there were guilty of. The person who wrote that does not currently post at MDD, at least under the name he used then, and I know other decent human beings, both LDS and not, condemned what he wrote. The thread repost at the top of the Terrestrial forum did not exist then or this post would surely have been preserved there.

The stickied thread at the top of the Terrestrial forum is mostly a place that collects some of the more extreme statements made at MDD: sometimes to respond to them, and sometimes to just virtually shake their heads at them. If people think such reposts go beyond simple reportage or mere snark, then a compromise would be to just remove the names from the quotes.

[_stemelbow]

Regarding culture of this board, why for example is a thread meant to mock participants on another board pinned to the top in Terrestial? That affects the culture. What does that have to do with issues in Mormonism? By pinning that... what is it meant to accomplish? in my opinion ...it makes this board look petty minded. But that is a decision by Shade and it affects the culture here.

I've made a similar point myself and now I"m kicking myself I didn't bring it up earlier. In truth, you are right, doing something like that contributes to the culture that is often quite petty.

[_asbestosman]

Can you point out examples of comments here that are inappropriate or cross some line?

I don't care to. I don't think I claimed it did. I said it contains a lot of mockery and I think it does so in a way that is unhelpful.

Is my context really all that hard to determine? Runtu, looks like I may need to meet you in the writer's guild.

[_Buffalo]

Can you point out examples of comments here that are inappropriate or cross some line?

I don't care to. I don't think I claimed it did. I said it contains a lot of mockery and I think it does so in a way that is unhelpful.

Is my context really all that hard to determine? Runtu, looks like I may need to meet you in the writer's guild.

I disagree - I think it's more than fair to comment on - and yes, even mock - stupid statements. That's a lot different than, say, calling someone a whore.

[_marg]

A response at MDD certainly isn't possible for most here.

A response to what? A personal attack? If you want to discuss an issue you are free to create a thread here and discuss it. And you can link to a thread on another board in which the issue is discussed and it's then in context for the readers here. That's a different scenario that taking a quote out of context from there, putting it into a thread here, meant to belittle another person or their thoughts.

Because I rarely read that board and I don't know the dynamics going on with the various players from both boards, and I don't read the pinned thread either, I'm assuming on MDDB they are not taking quotes from here out of context with the intent of belittling a person. I'm assuming they are not attacking participants from this board, who have not provoked them.

[_asbestosman]

I disagree - I think it's more than fair to comment on - and yes, even mock - stupid statements. That's a lot different than, say, calling someone a whore.

Fair? Perhaps. Useful? Sometimes. Different? Duh.

Do I think the thread in question is useful? No, not particularly. Those you are mocking generally aren't going to read or bother learning from it. It's a great way for you to get some yuks at their expense though. Forgive me if I don't think that's particularly noble.

I do think a critical thread can be useful. Criticizing outrageous comments such about the MMM seems like an excellent thing to do. Granted, it would be preferable if the author of that were made aware of how disgusting it was, but I'm glad to know that I need to be aware some members may harbor such idiotic and patently offensive notions. That nonsense needs to be corrected yesterday.

[Guest]

Hey Blixa,

Don't get me wrong, I completely get where you are coming from in relation to the content of the pinned thread. The post you've highlighted is - frankly - crazy. I totally agree - and I have no problem with it being highlighted.

I wasn't really commenting on whether the thread is 'good' or 'bad'. I'm only really commenting on the fact that the thread is pinned. If it wasn't, I don't think I would have anything to say except what I've already said earlier...

Lots of forums have pinned threads. But mostly they're utility threads. FAQ's, Rules of Conduct - things like that.
But this thread isn't. And I guess I just felt I had to acknowledge that marg was right in saying that the 'purpose' of pinning the thread can't be attributed to just 'free expression'. Not saying there can't possibly be good reasons to pin it anyway, and maybe it's a small thing. But it's a small thing that I felt I had to concede - it is a contribution to the culture that comes from the 'top-level'..

By admitting even an inch - maybe I'm giving a mile? *shrug* Donno. I don't want what I'm saying to be taken the wrong way, but it's probably going to be anyway.
As Frankie told us, that's what happens when two tribes go to war... :)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RTOQUnvI3CA