priesthood ban

[_MsJack]

So you're back with this again:

Women are not given the Priesthood, but that doesn't mean the Church is sexist

Actually, it does. Quite blatantly so.

But at least you're saying "sexist" now instead of "gender racist."

The actual reality is that men and women simply have different roles per the Gospel of Christ

I'll ask you the same question I asked you last time: what is the role of women in "the Gospel of Christ"? Men have a long list of responsibilities, callings, and ordinances to perform that are exclusive only to their "role." What responsibilities do women carry that are exclusive to them?

Last time I asked, you didn't answer.

[_malkie]

Can anyone post for me the official reason the Priesthood ban was put in place?
You know, the one where the official revelation was given, the reasoning etc Or where one of the recent Prophets (including Kimball) explains why doctrinally it was necessary.

I'm not after speculation, I'm after a General Authorities official pronouncement on such an important doctrinal decision.

I wonder if you might find it stored along with the revelation rescinding the ban - not the announcement that there had been a revelation, but the revelation itself.

[_Buffalo]

1. The ban only applied to those of "African" lineage, not blacks.

2. All other races including blacks of the Islands, non African blacks of Central/South America, India, etc. "were" given the Priesthood.

3. Skin color was only one of the ways to help determine lineage, but not the final way.

4. White men were denied the priesthood if they had African Lineage.

5. Lineage was determined by Patriarchal Blessing, and Family History Work, not because you were "black".

I love this argument. What Obiwan isn't aware of is that it's an excellent proof of the church's racist stance against African Americans. Coincidentally I'm sure, the church's policy mirrored the South's racist "one drop rule"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/One-drop_rule

[_Buffalo]

7. Christ Himself denied the Gospel to be given to any non-Jew. It took Peter after Christ's death to receive a Revelation to give the gospel to the Gentile. Was Christ a racist?

Yes.

[Guest]

Can anyone post for me the official reason the Priesthood ban was put in place?
You know, the one where the official revelation was given, the reasoning etc Or where one of the recent Prophets (including Kimball) explains why doctrinally it was necessary.

I'm not after speculation, I'm after a General Authorities official pronouncement on such an important doctrinal decision.

I wonder if you might find it stored along with the revelation rescinding the ban - not the announcement that there had been a revelation, but the revelation itself.

I think it would be extremely difficult to find out the Who, Why, When? of the
original Priesthood Ban.
Richard Abanes, writing in his One Nation Under Gods, 2002, quotes from Sterling M McMurrin (himself seen as a controversial figure) "In 1954 David O McKay went so far as to tell LDS philosopher Sterling M McMurrin that the racial ban on the priesthood was not a doctrine of the church, but rather only a practice of the church; one that would someday be removed."
McKay is quoted as saying, "I know of no scriptural basis for denying the Priesthood to Negroes other than one verse in the Book of Abraham 1:26"
McKay's private conversation with McMurrin would remain secret for many years.

The Book of Abraham was 'translated' in 1835, I believe, and Joseph Smith ordained Elijah Abel in 1836, as the first known black elder. One wonders, did Joseph Smith go on to allow the ordination of other black members? And when did the Book of Abraham 1:26, become accepted as some sort of 'evidence' of the priesthood bar issued from God?

[_jon]

Malcom, were the statements attributed to McKay accurate then that would mean he has incriminated himself, his predecessors and his successors in the office of Prophet Seer and Revelators as Racists.

He effectively says that no, it's not a doctrine from God, it's just that we think Blacks should be banned because of the colour of their skin.

My own personal belief, based on all the available evidence is that God is not a racist - but the Church (it's leadership rather than the totality of it's members) was and is. Young men are still actively taught that they should not marry girls outside of their race.

There was no revelation saying Blacks should be banned.
The Church was led astray by it's Prophets.

This one topic alone shows that the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints is fraudulent in it's claims of being the one true Church.

[_Doctor CamNC4Me]

Hello,

I see once again Mopologists are left to re-defining words & re-writing history.

Unfortunately for them Mormonism's racism is so well documented & so many statements made by Mormon leaders on the subject make it beyond clear that it would be better just to accept the Church was racist and let it be.

But no... The culture of lying is so deeply ingrained in Mormonism that it's apologists are instinctively following suit. It's astonishing, but not unexpected to see someone point at a rock and say, "No, it's really impacted earth and thus, if you look closely enough, it was never a rock but millions of tiny sand crystals living in close habitation."

V/R
Dr. Cameron

[_Malcolm]

Malcom, were the statements attributed to McKay accurate then that would mean he has incriminated himself, his predecessors and his successors in the office of Prophet Seer and Revelators as Racists.

He effectively says that no, it's not a doctrine from God, it's just that we think Blacks should be banned because of the colour of their skin.

My own personal belief, based on all the available evidence is that God is not a racist - but the Church (it's leadership rather than the totality of it's members) was and is. Young men are still actively taught that they should not marry girls outside of their race.

There was no revelation saying Blacks should be banned.
The Church was led astray by it's Prophets.

This one topic alone shows that the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints is fraudulent in it's claims of being the one true Church.

Hi Jon,
Yes, I could not agree more.
When I joined the fold here in the UK, in the 1970's, I had no idea that the church was racist. I was met at the chapel door, by a handsome West Indian man called Bernard, he and his family were so busy within the ward that they attended almost everything, cleaned the grounds, bore their testimonies and were real Saints. It was not until a year or so later that I found out that Bernard had not held the Priesthood. Then in 1978 of course came the revelation and the Bernards of the world were suddenly 'blessed'.
Yes, the church is still racist and it will be for many years to come. I literally thank God, the Great Spirit, whatever one wishes to call it, that I am no longer a Mormon.

[_Doctor CamNC4Me]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tggtPHDmrR8

[_Malcolm]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tggtPHDmrR8

Hi Doc,
This was most amusing.
Hope that the Book of Mormon musical eventually comes out on DVD here in the UK.