Defenders, please show me real examples of "persecution"

[_Polygamy-Porter]

What you described and what you previously described is not discrimination.

What actually happened to your daughter is kind of sad because it has nothing to do with religion and religious practices, but a religion has the right to say who gets and who does not get awards from its organization.

Your refined example is even less problematic. A camp counselor in a religious camp should be expected to adhere to the religions' beliefs.

I started the informal process of seeking an advanced degree from Fuller Theological Institute. It required the recommendation of a pastor or priest. I asked if a Mormon bishop's recommendation would qualify, and was told "no," and further discouraged from applying because I was a Mormon. I don't consider that discrimination. Fuller has the right to call its own shots.

BYU hires non-members for its faculty. But, it doesn't have to do so and could choose not to do so and no court in the land would hold it guilty of discrimination.

There you have it folks! Straight from the lawyer's mouth.

[Personal information deleted by mod Scottie]

[_Scottie]

I already stated the obvious.

Xtians see the LDS cult as a threat and are simply protecting themselves and their clients from that threat.

And you are defending it. It appears in your mind that you think this was the right thing to do.

Simply put, was it or was it not persecution?

[_Yahoo Bot]

There you have it folks! Straight from the lawyer's mouth.

[Personal information deleted by mod Scottie]

I'd say that unless I disclosed a personal aspect of my life on this Board you leave my personal life out of your posts. I've never said I've worked for anything called LDS Inc. or for the Church.

[_Polygamy-Porter]

I already stated the obvious.

Xtians see the LDS cult as a threat and are simply protecting themselves and their clients from that threat.

And you are defending it. It appears in your mind that you think this was the right thing to do.

Simply put, was it or was it not persecution?

The business owners are making choices to protect their clients.

No it is not persecution.

I don't know how much Consig's duaghter wear her religion on her sleeve, but perhaps they either did not like how "Mormon" she appeared or they simply do not trust Mormons period.

Either way, it is their religious business and they can pick who they hire. Just like LDS Inc.

Does it make it right? In a business sense yes.

I will never apply for a job at LDS Inc.

Perhaps Consig will know better next time and not let his daughter apply for a position at a religious camp not associated with LDS Inc.

[_Polygamy-Porter]

There you have it folks! Straight from the lawyer's mouth.

[Personal information deleted by mod Scottie]

I'd say that unless I disclosed a personal aspect of my life on this Board you leave my personal life out of your posts. I've never said I've worked for anything called LDS Inc. or for the Church.

Oh DEAR!! SAVE YOUR POSTS!!

Board WWII is about to happen!
If I recall correctly you have made posts under another account here about your work as a lawyer for LDS Inc.

[_zeezrom]

Porter,

Here is an example of persecution that people around me still feel. Whether or not it is an honest depiction is not my point. My point is the believers around me truly feel this is persecution and it is internalized today as something personal to them. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L7nOEhTICAE

I would venture to guess it bolsters their belief in Mormonism. So be it.

Sorry but the "persecution" in the early days of the church was brought about by certain doctrines and principles which are no longer practiced in the mainstream LDS chruch.

The FLDS are "persecuted" for practicing these same doctrines and principles. The mainstream Mormons are nothing more than a large version of the RLDS.

Whether it is an honest depiction or not, the members today still personalize it. Does it matter why the persecution was brought on? I'm not asking this question rhetorically. I really want to know what people think.

[_consiglieri]

Some questions, consiglieri:

(1) Is there any kind of religious instruction at the Free Methodist horse camp?
(2) Even if there is no direct religious instruction, do they consider the camp to be a sort of potential evangelization project towards non-Christians who attend there?
(3) Did the lower level leaders who encouraged your daughter to apply know that she was Mormon?
(4) Were your daughter's other friends who were accepted Christians of any kind?

Thanks in advance.

Hi, MsJack!

Here is my best shot at answering your questions:

(1) First, so you know, it is not actually called the "Free Methodist Horse Camp." I don't want to give the actual name, so let me say it would be along the lines of, "Whispering Firs Camp."

But to your question, the only religious instruction is "chapel" time they have every morning, but that is not handled by youth counsellors. They have a pastor on duty who takes care of that.

(2) I would be guessing at this, but I would suspect so. I believe my daughter came back from an earlier camp experience having been "saved." We told her that was wonderful and tried to explain how Jesus is the most important thing, but that what we do and how we live is also important.

(3) Absolutely! Because religion is discussed from time to time, my daughter has had ample opportunity to express her religious affiliation. I don't know whether this was passed up the chain to the upper level, but I expect that when they got the application, which asks for religious denomination, and saw she had written in LDS, they figured it out for themselves. They also asked for a letter from her religious leader and we sent one from our bishop. Another clue!

(4) Here I haven't a clue. Sorry.

All the Best!

--Consiglieri

[_Yahoo Bot]

I just don't recall that. It would be improper for me to discuss or admit to clients other than what I post on my on-line resume. Clients large and small probably don't want me discussing them.

But if you point me to a post --

[_consiglieri]

What does FLDS moving into my town have to do with denying an LDS member from attending a horse camp???

Just to make sure I am being clear, my daughter was accepted over ten times during the last five-years to attend the horse camp.

It was only when she applied to be a counsellor that she was rejected.

All the Best!

--Consiglieri

[_consiglieri]

Perhaps Consig will know better next time and not let his daughter apply for a position at a religious camp not associated with LDS Inc.

Interesting how this has now shifted into my daughter's rejection becoming my fault . . .