Why you leave is no one else's business

[_zeezrom]

Runtu,

I appreciate your comments and I agree with you. Most people I know won't ask why I left but will instead choose to bear testimony to me in various ways. I'm totally fine with that. I just hope they are okay with hearing added perspectives. For example, let's assume he starts talking about the resurrection. I won't say, hey that's a bunch of hogwash! No. I would instead ask, do you think I will have a six pack in heaven? I've been trying to get one for ages and it would be really cool to finally get it. My wife likely would have a hard time keeping her eyes off me. The only prob is I will be a smoothie so our love will, sadly, be unfulfilled. That's why she and I try really hard to fulfill that area of our life as much as possible, despite the absence of a six pack.

Personally, I think this would be a fun conversation...

[_Runtu]

Just got off the phone with the friend I mentioned. He said he needed to clarify some things:

1. He felt obligated to explain to his wife and children why he didn't believe, so he was open with them, even though it was quite painful and traumatic. He did not feel the same need with others, so he adopted the policy that I outlined.

2. When people were "in [his] face" about the church, he told them he would hear them out as long as they were willing to hear him out. No one took him up on the offer.

3. It's true that he doesn't get harassed about church, but he said that's because church members don't talk to him at all. At a stake priesthood meeting, he was mentioned by name as someone people should not talk to, lest any more people be sucked into apostasy (I should mention that the Relief Society president and Elders Quorum president and their spouses left within three weeks of his departure, though my friend was not a factor in their exits). He said that when he sees people from the church, they go out of their way not to talk to him, which makes him sad.

[_Runtu]

Runtu,

I appreciate your comments and I agree with you. Most people I know won't ask why I left but will instead choose to bear testimony to me in various ways. I'm totally fine with that. I just hope they are okay with hearing added perspectives. For example, let's assume he starts talking about the resurrection. I won't say, hey that's a bunch of hogwash! No. I would instead ask, do you think I will have a six pack in heaven? I've been trying to get one for ages and it would be really cool to finally get it. My wife likely would have a hard time keeping her eyes off me. The only prob is I will be a smoothie so our love will, sadly, be unfulfilled. That's why she and I try really hard to fulfill that area of our life as much as possible, despite the absence of a six pack.

Personally, I think this would be a fun conversation...

I'd just ask myself, what do I want to happen from this conversation, and what is the likely outcome? If I can't answer those questions with positive answers, it might be fun, but it's unlikely to be productive. Just my two cents.

[_zeezrom]

Runtu,

It just isn't natural for me to start every conversation that way. Usually, I talk to people with this question in mind: "what is interesting?"

Mind you, I wouldn't have this particular type of conversation with say, my mom or the YW Pres.

[_Runtu]

Runtu,

It just isn't natural for me to start every conversation that way. Usually, I talk to people with this question in mind: "what is interesting?"

Mind you, I wouldn't have this particular type of conversation with say, my mom or the YW Pres.

I don't start every conversation that way, either, but if it's about a subject that could potentially cause conflict, I do think about what I'm trying to achieve.

For example, I'd have no trouble talking politics with Bob Bennett, who is an old family friend and who is, after all, a politician. But I'm not going start a conversation about politics with my conspiracy-theorist coworker, as the outcome is pretty certain.

Similarly, I enjoy talking about religion with my home teacher, who is a retired classics professor. I would not go out of my way to talk religion to the armed Uruguayans I know who spent time in the federal pen for trying to rescue President Benson, who they were sure was being drugged and held against his will so he couldn't speak out on the anti-Christ and the black helicopters.

ETA: I've talked to my father on many occasions about my problems with the church because he listens and wants to understand my point of view. I don't talk about the issues with my wife or my mother, because they have already let me know they aren't interested. It doesn't help to bring it up, so I don't.

[_MCB]

However, to know what is wrong with LDS doctrine, literature, and culture helps one understand why many LDS victimize others.

[_Runtu]

However, to know what is wrong with LDS doctrine, literature, and culture helps one understand why many LDS victimize others.

Sure, but you have to pick your battles. 9 times out of 10 trying to explain "what is wrong" with anything LDS-related is going to end badly with a believing member.

I guess I see it this way: I felt an obligation to explain to my wife why I didn't believe. We had a long and contentious conversation off and on for about 2 years. It only ended with me in a mental hospital and us almost splitting up. I finally sat down with her and asked her why she wanted to know my reasons for leaving. She said it was so she could show me I'm wrong, and when all else failed, she could bear her testimony. At that point, we agreed we weren't going to get anywhere discussing these issues.

Mind you, I'm not saying "keep your mouth shut," like so many of the MADB folks say, but just that we aren't obligated to explain ourselves to anyone, except maybe immediate family. We don't have to explain ourselves to every random church member or leader who wants to know. But if I feel like explaining myself, and I think there might be some good from it, I'll do it.

[_MCB]

No, I am not talking about battling with LDS, I am talking about healing for those who have exited, particularly if it was painful. And of course healing also for never-Mos who have encountered mo-nastiness.

[_harmony]

Personally, I don't think it's anyone's business, period. I think Mormons are altogether too nosy.

[_Runtu]

No, I am not talking about battling with LDS, I am talking about healing for those who have exited, particularly if it was painful. And of course healing also for never-Mos who have encountered mo-nastiness.

That goes without saying. I have no trouble talking to ex-Mormons or never-Mormons about why I left and why it was so painful. I've felt a moral obligation to help those who are in pain and struggling over the loss of their faith.