Jason Bourne wrote:Aristotle Smith wrote:
For a generic grouping term to have any meaning, there has to be some commonality. At some point the differences become stark enough so that "We aren't the same type of X" becomes functionally equivalent to "We aren't X."
No not really. I am a human but I am not African or Asian. But I am still a human.
Irrelevant as the analogy is not comparable. This is like saying "I am a Christian, but not Baptist or Presbyterian." It might be true, it might not be true. You might be a Methodist, a Mormon, or an Orthodox Jew. For some values the sentence will still be true, for others it won't.
Jason Bourne wrote:I was simply stating what it means to claim to be a restoration. Other than the 19th century rhetoric that you quote below I think it is pretty clear the the LDS Church always considered itself to be a Christian denomination and also considered the rest of the Christian denominations Christian albeit lacking total truth. The dichotomy you set forth above is not one adopted in totality by the LDS Church.
I don't really care if it is adopted by the totality of the LDS church. The majority of male Mormons probably watch porn, does that mean that the LDS church officially allows porn viewing? The highest leaders and the scriptures of the church make it clear that all other so-called Christian churches aren't, and that only the LDS church has any claim to be the true church of Christ. Thus, the dichotomy exists as per Mormon scripture, sorry if you find JSH to be an inconvenience.
And, I think you would be surprised as to how many Mormons actually do believe in the dichotomy. It's hard for New Order Mormons to remember sometimes what more orthodox Mormons actually think. I got burned on this myself just a few weeks ago. I was talking about a book on the historical Jesus with my brother-in-law in the presence of my mother and sister. They all know I am not a Mormon anymore.
Keep in mind this was a purely scholarly book on the historical Jesus by Paula Fredricksen (who is a Jew). My mother and sister got really pissed and asked me to stop talking about it. My sister stormed out of the room when I did not stop, with my mother following behind. I found out later why they were pissed, it's because I no longer believe in the same Jesus as they do, their words, not mine. It was just a big wake up call for me. As much as New Order Mormons and liberal Mormons like to pretend otherwise, there is a vast gulf between Christianity and Mormons, and that gulf is set up and maintained to a large degree by Mormons.
Look, I would LOVE for this gulf to go away. It would make my life a lot easier. But I can't pretend that "we're all Christians" when everything Mormons do says I'm not. I'm sorry it's really hard to sing cumbaya and pretend like we're all on the same team.
The bottom line is that I really don't have much of a problem when Mormons claim they are Christians. It's the corrollary of that statement, that I most certainly am not a Christian (at least not one that counts), that really pisses me off.